How would you rate the jobs currently?
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Timestamps:
0:00 Introduction & DISCLAIMER
1:05 Tanking Jobs
2:55 Melee Jobs
5:02 Ranged Physical Jobs
6:06 Casting Jobs
7:48 Healing Jobs
8:27 Final Tier Placement
8:38 Closing Thoughts
8:58 Outro
#FFXIV #dawntrail #TierList
source
My boy MCH is loosing in all fronts. Wish we could be a bit better 😢
reaper would need a full rework if deaths design if it got removed, it helps with alignment and double enshroud. its one of the best made jobs in the game and honestly S tier, even if its less damage than sam and viper
I have to agree with your Tier List. SMN, DRK, & MCH either needs BIG BUFFS OR BIG Changes coming in 7.3 or later, but I guess the big changes won't happen until 8.0.
Imo all the casters are c tier except pct. Resses can help best the boss sure but if that's all they're good for they're pointless overall. Smn and rdm damage is in the dumpster and pct is easier the blm and overall still does more damage
Whm be like did you die tho?
I wonder how the tier list shifts if we don't look at raids, and focus only on Dungeons as the focus shifts from single bosses to mob packs and less coordinated groups.
4:14 "and many people have been dissatisfied with the Dawntrail changes"
Really? I had no idea that there were a lot of people who didn't like the changes. Me personally, I love it!
I've been a Monk main since early access ARR and became a little bit more of a Gunbreaker main after that was introduced but I have never had a much fun with Monk before this.
I even almost gave up on Monk in Endwalker but Dawntrail brought me back into it.
Why are they adamant about not letting MCH have higher damage?
And if you're not going to let us hide the lunchbox then the least make unique models for it to match the gun.
You manage to have a pallette to match each Picto brush? Bruh…
Really hope they buff or rework DRK soon man, absolutely love the class and it hurts seeing how bad it's gotten.
Pld gang rise up
Ninja is S and so is monk and reaper 😭
I love red mage because it's fun. I like the feel, the look, and the style. I accept that I do less damage than most.
However, I will never agree with Summoner and Red Mage doing less damage because they have an ability that only comes into play when someone else makes a mistake.
Standard SE. They overpower the new jobs for the hype and completely forget about other jobs until people complain for months on the official forums. Sometimes they even nerf jobs that would compete with the new jobs such as when MCH came out, they nerfed BRD so badly that no one played it. Then when DNC came out, they screwed both MCH and BRD. RPR came out, they screwed MNK and DRG. SGE came out they screwed the other healers, especially AST. PCT screwed SMN and to a lesser extent BLM but that got slightly fixed with this last patch. Can't have Yoshi-P's favorite job being bad now!
idk, I'd put BLM in A or A- simply because it takes WAY more effort to play well than picto and picto having a raid buff. Thunderhead needs to go away and flare star needs to become instant or something else. It's far and away from Endwalker BLM.
Viper being one of the heaviest hitting melee classes while also having ranged options that are even more optimal than Ninja for disengages (via Uncoiled Fury) is wild. Being able to save the stacks for mechanics like Alarm Phermones or Defamations in M2S is definitely giving it an edge over the rest in terms of melee uptime since it doesn't require those casts for burst phases.
More people play WHM because of aesthetics and it's simplicity. But AST brings a raid buff, more raid mit, and more utility.
The problem with the BLM vs Picto (or any selfish dps for that matter) is still the same, picto still has a tremendous amount of damage for how permissive and easy to use it is and for how much of an insane amount of utility it brings to the party: a raid damage buff, a personal shield that can be transformed into a raidwide shield, a heal, a kinda leylines and all of this on top of being probably the 2nd easiest caster after the summoner, meanwhile it's competing to be at the top of the charts or it is straight up at the top sometimes.
I don't understand why samurai belon to S tier since it is harder than viper, do as much damage as monk and reaper
What I think? 🤔
I think this video, and any similar dps tier list content, is poo. The use of 'corrected' axes on the graphs, meaning they don't start at zero dps, distort the importance of the dps issue. A 10% difference in average dps between Viper and Machinist is nothing. Individual player skill will more than make up for this, if a given player prefer one job over the other.
Try having your graphs start at zero dps on the left, the next time you make one of these videos. Suddenly you don't have much of a story…
For DRK it’s worth keeping in mind that they succeed well with aDPS. Perhaps B tier is a bit too low. They are still the highest aDPS tank, and for every boss in rDPS and aDPS there are multiple DRKS in top ten. As of today, top 3 aDPS on M4S are DRKS. Not to say they’re stronger than the others, just that they definitely aren’t multiple leagues below the other tanks. Also worth noting that DRK magic mit always comes in strong for ultis! 🙂
I’m sorry, but I can consistently get more out of my white mage than any other healer, and god knows I’ve done them all. When it comes to recovering from a bad situation, WHM is just the best because of how endlessly flexible it is. The others… if their good stuff is on cooldown, they’re in trouble.
This tier list doesn't make any sense. Are you ranking for progression? For optimization/parsing? For normal content? For higher level content?
You seem to be ranking from a purely damage perspective when analyzing logs, but it's not consistent at all. To rank all the physical ranged lower than melee simply because they don't reach the same DPS as SAM/VPR is absurd, as it would eliminate the need to run melees at all. It de-values the importance of phys ranged, namely Bard and Dancer who bring a multitude of utility, such as Improvisation, Shield Samba, Dance Partner, Troubadour, Nature's Minne, that's without counting role actions too. Even MCH is a huge help to bring to progression as it brings Dismantle and Tactician, two valuable mitigation options.
You took into account the utility that tanks bring in to the party, but then defaulted to purely damage numbers to rank the rest of the classes. By your metrics, Sage would be bottom of the list due to the lack of rDPS it brings to a party. But then you bring up the utility that they bring and rank them at S. But then you rank SAM as S even though it's not doing as much damage as RPR/MNK. It simply doesn't make sense.
The only class that genuinely needs a rework/buff is DRK as they're lacking in both utility and damage. But all in all, I believe it is very harmful to present phys ranged in such a negative light when they are in fact doing well.
I dont think reaper's death's design needs much change as it stands right now because it allows for fitting two communios in an arcane circle buff since it is not closed off when entering enshroud. It aligns up pretty well and I don't think it hinders any gameplay.
I personally have and probably will still continue to play reaper because of two main reasons:
1. It has raid buffs that are always a nice thing for groups, which also increases the potency of my plentiful harvest
2. It allows me to have a lot more focus on mechanics in a fight I am learning since it's pretty simple to play and doesn't have a ton of things to monitor aside from death's design and your arcane circle timer
I main Dancer…and I honestly think ALL of the "supporter" roles need a DPS buff. When I see a Warrior come in and all but 2 or 3 shot a mob soloing while I take almost a full Standard Step timer to down one or more mobs….it just takes a little joy out of it.
Deaths Design Reworked?!
NO?! Why?!
Deaths Design works well enough?! Why would you want to rework Deaths Design?!
I'm expecting a small rework of DRK like they did with PLD during EW but thats just me coping cause I feel like they just dont care at all about DRK, it's soooo bad 😢
Let me guess, BLM TOP 1 DPS, HELL YEAH
*Edit*, argh well almost
Completly random but does anyone know what glam was on his NIN when he showed it ? With the veil on her face . I need that glam now.
I think k the tank switch should follow what they did with healers in the regards to pure and barrier healers not the same gimmick but that kind of idea warrior and paladin as support tanks, gunbreaker and dark knight as offensive
Granting a job S tier based on aDPS is actually crazy. aDPS is not how a job's damage is calculated.
Idk for me Nin and Drg is a bit to far off, I agree with drk and prange are off to far and especially mch but for me that’s every expansion the case since your explanation proves the point.
Dark Knight has been the worst tank for 3 expansions now…
I dont want a TBN rework cause they'll just make it a hoc or bloodwhetting and that would be shit
I think red mage should be in S for Style since its the most stylish job in the game.
I still find it funny that people expected them to nerf pictomancer. They generally don't nerf any jobs and instead buff the ones falling behind.
But Viper sucks a lot now, am I right guys? 😂🤡🤡
BLM has always been my favorite class since I started to play FFXIV, but in DT it is nothing but tears
Disagree on the tanks. Paladin S tier for utility kit and great damage. Gunbreaker is A+, probably the most balanced of the tanks. Warrior and Dark Knight at A tier, maybe DRK at A-, but not B. Warrior has more self-sustain but looking at aDPS, Dark Knight is the hardest hitting tank right now, so you do need some tradeoff there. Can it be better? Yes, but it's not as terrible as some make it out to be.
Hold up drk has the lowest dps…with the worst self sustain and outside of magic not enough mitigation and TBN needs a major rework…seriously wth SE
Also i would put blm in B tier with 0 utility and a rotation that's so easy to mess up you'll be getting out performed by dnc
Going by the Logs isn't a currently accurate depiction of Pictomancer right now. Most Pictomancers I see overall float around the same as SMN and RDM.
Just like how Yoshi-P said, "Job effectiveness will vary depending on player skill", if they Nerf Pictomancer, those lower end players (Which are more common than one might imagine) will be now competing with the current Phys Ranged instead of the other Casters.
And if that happens, Picto, which is a currently popular job, could be seen as underperforming (most of the times) by the players experiences with it, leading to it being possibly barred from a lot of PFs.
What needs to happen isn't only a change to Picto, buffing or nerfing it, but a conjunct set of changes to all casters, so if such things were to happen, the impact will be lessened.
Or just give it a bit of time until the honeymoon phase with the job is gone, and they can adjust it with less people complaining about it.
meanwhile in actual practice DRK is the highest dmg tank while people like this claim its the lowest… because the way the community likes to look at stats makes perfect sense and totally means something. DRK is fine in terms of damage and mitigation. Its tools are not the best and heck you can even argue they suck but they are good enough for the fights we have access to rn, and im fairly certain will continue to be good enough for the future. The class plays like a hollow shell that has a summoner level rotation. It FEELS bad to play. It is not at all, a bad class.
I'm all for expressing gripes with current job design, but copying other content creators' ideas and putting them into a video without giving reasoning as to why you think these things are true or what possible solutions could be implemented looks shallow. Saying things like "carve and spit and abyssal drain shouldn't share a recast timer" or "tbn needs to be reworked" isn't technically wrong, but I've seen two videos from other content creators this week saying the same thing and those creators gave alternative ideas or potential solutions for how the abilities could be reworked. Just quoting someone else without giving credit to the person whose ideas you're regurgitating or at the very least, providing your own take on why you agree with the idea is just dishonest content creation.
"Reaper just needs its death's design to be reworked and it would be near perfect in balancing and gameplay" is a nothing-burger of a statement. What about the ability is bad? Why should it be reworked? How would that help the job? Making the claim that "X ability is bad so change it and the job will be better" is the lowest-effort take you could've given on reaper and I've already read that from armchair devs in the Balance discord, reddit, and other social media sites. Why do I keep hearing the same opinions from different sources presented as if THIS is the first time someone's said it.
I'm sure this comes off pretty rude and I'll own that, but my point is that FFXIV content creation has been so lazy lately and I don't like seeing every content creator in the space do the same videos over the course of 3/4 days when a new idea comes up the pipeline. How many "We need to talk about X job" or "Is casual content too hard?" or "Is this savage tier too easy?" videos are going to be crammed down our feeds without anyone actually presenting their own ideas? If you want to chime in on the discussion, by all means go for it, but at least have your own ideas made up instead of copying what other people have said.
ninja dmg numbers make me cry. To me ninja feels busier than viper despite the 1 apm difference because we need to actively set up burst 20 seconds in advance, keeping track of bunshin and ninki to ensure it remains on cd without drift/overcap, and blow our entire load in 20 seconds every minute. All that work to do the least dps of all melees xD I'm still riding the high from being top dps in EW once upon a time, I want to go back to the glory days haha
Please for the love of god do not remove deaths design
i hate the changes theyve made to Dragoon…
I just want Bio and Miasma back on Summoner.
They need to fix the animation stance. Dragoon and DRK walking while holding their weapon is so outdated and ugly! The only one that has acceptable stance is Ninja and Gunbreaker. The rest are so corny
Deaths design doesnt need a rework.
I'm a NIN main since it first came out back in ARR and I just feel like we're back to Shadowbringers again, where we are over here playing the piano and still getting bottom tier melee dps. Hopefully they give NIN a bit of a boost so we can compete with the other melee dps.
as a DRK and PLD main. I honestly prefer DRK to PLD atm. Which is a change for me.
Re your tank tiering, and general tiering. I notice you're basing it off All Percentile.
Usually, I check out 95%, at least 80% to get a better look at differences.
I'd say the biggest red flag with DRK, rather than it's actual dps output (which at 95 and 80, all the tanks are very close together), is the fact that DRK has half as many parses at the time I post this (27k for DRK), as WAR (56k). They also have 20k fewer parses than GNB, and 14k fewer than PLD. So more than the damage numbers, it's just not being played anywhere near to the same degree as the other 3 tanks.