This plugin is incredibly creepy and I don’t see what it would feasibly be used for besides stalking. Even if there was a beneficial use, I think it’ll ultimately do more harm than good. I hope SE takes this one seriously and reworks the current blacklist system so that it can no longer be exploited like this.
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Chapters:
0:00 – 0:55 Why it’s important to talk about this
0:56 – 1:40 What is PlayerScope?
1:40 -3:04 SE’s efforts to improve privacy/combat harassment
3:04 – 6:14 PlayerScope trivializes SE’s efforts
6:14 – 7:49 This plugin has no beneficial uses
7:49 – 8:36 Yes, you can get stalked in-game.
8:36 – 9:23 People should be allowed to keep alts private
9:23 – 10:39 You’re already opted-in!
10:39 – 11:53 I don’t need a tool to identify bots
11:53 – 13:35 Only SE can fix this
13:35 – 14:12 What are your thoughts?
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I feel like this plug-in kinda exposes a flaw in FF14.
Even if this author got forced to take it down, who's to say someone else can't write their own version.
I do hope this encourages the dev team to take another at blacklisting, and how it works on the back end
The worst part is, the moderators took down the biggest topic warning people about it on the official forums, with nothing said by a GM before or after about the situation being looked into which has given a LOT of people the wrong impression that Square-Enix is trying to brush the whole thing under a rug.
Not helping the issue is that this was AFTER Square-Enix's new policy changes where they consider "undue demand" to be a potentially actionable offense, leaving some people worried to say anything further or ask for a fix on any official channels, or that a lot of people are only finding out about the privacy issue at all due to content creators like yourself and not SE directly.
It's not the greatest optics right now, not that January has been great for them in general.
Dude I need that hairstyle for my miqo so bad. Maybe one day I'll suffer through pf for it but I don't wanna suffer rn ..
how can a mod bypass SE security is it that easy? this is gross
We can't pretend though that FF14 didn't have a stalking problem before this. The blacklist system is a joke as it stands, post-update included. While I agree this plugin isn't great, there are a lot of in house problems they need to address first.
I agree with you completely. This sort of plugin is an inevitable consequence of how the blacklist was changed. SE should change the blacklist again as urgently as possible.
The idea that it was opt-out and not opt-in is wild and makes it clear the intentions of this plugin and the data it’s scraping. Then to tell people yes go to this random discord to opt out. Like yeah sure I worry about my privacy so let me use a sketch ass discord and add another digital footprint to a bunch of people who already want as much of this as they can. Uh..no.
Unfortunately the genie is out of the bottle and the data has been scraped so largely that people now have access to a huge list of ids and names. Like you said, this won’t stop it. It will be back.
While SE needs to fix stuff on their end, all people can do now is try to keep themselves safe in whatever way that’s possible.
Using user ID numbers is actually a brilliant way to make the blacklist work better but bad faith actors had to go and ruin it. This isn't a security issue, its a modder issue because any modder can do this.
The only solution is to cut off ALL mods by implementing a weekly micro patch system so modders can never update in time for the next micro patch. To save this game, the devs have to nuke all mods and the game will be better for it.
Best community
more content creators desperate for that 2 dollar youtube commision, oh no someones goan find your erp alt. I hope mods get banned completely.
Several dumb thoughts for Lord Algorithm and commenters:
1. SE has a major responsibility for creating the system the way they did. Not sure what the alternatives would be, as I'm not experienced in server management, and the alternatives I see people posting seem like just an extra step that a bad actor would need to take to accomplish the same goal (which every obstacle does make it less likely someone will accomplish it, but doesn't eliminate the possibility), or just irrelevant to the actual problem with clientside access to the database of account IDs.
2. I know everyone hates the big corp they pay for a service, but this is a time that SE needs to make an example of this person, legally. Does it fix the problem? No. What it does is create a psychological barrier that will reduce the number of people willing to risk creating something to circumvent whatever solution SE comes up with.
3. This isn't an issue that only affects those who play with mods. It affects anyone who plays XIV. SE is not going to ignore it because it's a "mod issue."
4. SE will most likely address this in a less than public way. People forget, SE is a company. Their players sign a ToS. It opens mountains of legal issues for a company to publicly admit to knowing that many of their customers/players are breaking ToS, and they are not doing anything about it. Being an online game, I would be surprised if JP laws don't require some strict moderation of 3rd party plugins, whether that means banning all or have a strict list of allowed mods.
4.1. If you're asking "Then why doesn't SE just make a whitelist of the biggest mods?" See the G-Shade fiasco.
5. SE is not going to start micro-patching. In order for micro-patching to work, something has to be patched in such a way to mess with the mod. That means time will have to be spent to create the patches. Which means someone will have to be paid for making the patch instead of doing something to contribute to the profits. Stop being delusional.
6. If you think Anti-cheats are going to stop modding, especially malicious modding, I have a lake to sell you in the Mojave Desert. Online games have been dealing with 3rd party plugins for nearly their entire existence, and it's been a losing battle.
7. If you are being stalked or harassed online, check to see if you live in a country or province that has legal recourses. More than a few have updated their laws due to the prevalence of the internet in our everyday lives (feel ancient saying that). I know it may sound scary, but online behaviors can only be stopped offline.
it wasn't this specific plugin but I had a experience with someone who had a similar plugin that showed where players where on the map and if they where friends, in the same fc, and so on. I did not know this at the time (or that this even existed) and i was friends with that person. but after a while i started to notice that no matter where in the world i logged in they where next to me within a minute. it's was very uncomfortable. fortunately they have since stopped doing this and in the end my personal experience with these tools being used to track me hasn't resulted in anything big. but the fact that it was possible in the first place is not comforting.
i saw a other youtuber talk about this before your video as well. I happen to have a github account so i reported the repo it was on describing this as a tool for privacy invasion. I haven't heard back from them (except a comformation that my report has been accepted) but it is good to know the plugin is no longer accessible. though in the end that doesn't solve the issue. I don't doubt they still have the code somewhere and they could set up a different repo somewhere else. like you say only se can address this.
This is bad. Because this also will make way for anti cheats that run in the background of your computer. This consumes more power from your pc and makes things slower. The fps drops on pc will be massive. Not to mention, that is also an invasion of privacy because the anti cheat scans all your pc files.
I stopped playing blade and soul because of their anti cheats, this didnt stop bots though.
This is really not something anyone needed. So you can opt out by going to several places that will basically self-identify you Lol.
People, if you go to opt out, you gotta do it under an alternative unused alias.
the excuse that it's "just meant to track player retainers" makes me laugh like how is that beneficial in the slightest 😭
the github has been deleted by github staff, its seem , eitther SQE, or github got a warning about it being stalkerisk
This is the first I'm hearing about this so I'm glad you made this video.
Cheap sells. Sorry, but people are going to undercut on the MB. Hopefully none of these people in game are business owners IRL because irl business does the same thing and it's called competition. They gotta get over it. There's barely anything worth it to buy with gil anyway. They obviously do content that allows them to put up expensive, rare stuff on the MB, so they literally have less use for gil than a casual player does. It's a video game also. Why people get so flustered over are video game, I'll never understand. Go outside.
I think the biggest problem here is that the damage is already done. SE can stop further damage, but nothing can be done about the damage already done.
im usin this to find CHICKS
this mod brakes all TOS and is a massive security breach, it being able to exists is a massive breach of trust on SEs part, this mod serves no perpose than to stalk and harass people
this mod and anyone who are found to use it should be band and have possible criminal charges brought agaisnt them
at the bare minumum the mod maker and the team should all imidiatly have charges brought for stlaking and enabling stalking
people have too much free time if they have the energy to stalk another persons video game character
If we ever cross paths (blue moon kitter) I'll give you a /dote and a /petals (as is the age old custom) and be on my merry way! o/
"just because you blacklist someone doesn't mean they're not still following you around." can confirm that this is true
Creepy. That's all I need to say.
OK, you want Square Enix doing something against a third party tool. Did you know that the use of any third party software (tools, mods etc.) is forbidden by the terms of service? By playing the game you and all the other players agreed on that terms of use. with that basic knowledge do you really think they will do anything against it?
Seems Github took it down thankfully
Apperently 4chan made their own database for this plugin and are tracking everyone too.
Yeah, I've had people use plug-ins to instantly teleport to me, stalk me across the map, purchase alt-accounts to wait outside my house while afk – and wait for me to respawn after exiting instances.
Sometimes you just want to play the game in peace, so this is a big issue. Guess I let my sub run out at a good time.
The only thing SE can do is change the blacklist system at it's core. This information is being communicated regardless of plugins and anyone that knows how can rip the info client side so long as the blacklist system continues to communicate that info to the client. Unfortunately there is no way for SE to see/confirm what plugins people are actively running as it violates privacy laws iirc. This is why they take the 'don't ask don't tell' approach to things like parsers, visual mods, etc.
As someone who uses only a handful of QoL plugins like confirmations automatically being on "yes" instead of "no", Id honestly rather them to get rid of plugins entirely than continue indulging this kind of creepy ass shit. Even if i surely would miss some of the QoL stuff. But I know that wont happen because it is most likely that the majority of the playerbase will quit, just by basing it on looking at download numbers for some of these plugins.
As someone who doesnt programm and knows very little about it, it still seems unreal and bizarre to me that you wouldnt encrypt something like an AccountID when the clients "communicate" with each other to void a blacklisted person, and make the encrypted info only possible to read/decrypt on the server side. Thats so wild.
It got taken down by reports, it'll be back up or another one will take it's place. They didn't take it down for any reason you think I promise you that.
Also, if you want something done. Be prepared to say bye bye to your mods completely. That's the literal step that's going to be taken if that's what you all want. Because the genie is out of the bottle now. There's no putting it back and there will be other mods that come up that do MORE than what this one did.
Also, ya'll need to star being upset at SE for half assing their code YET AGAIN.
It is sadly to late for a fix, Cole Evyx has a video explaining why SE can never fix what they did with the blacklist system.
If at all the 7.0 patch make it EASIER for stalkers to follow you around.
They get removed from your view. But you are not removed from their view. So for all purposes you got invisible creeps following you around.
And the plugin does not only share your alts and retainers, but also your position in the game.
To minimize the problem you could make your lodestone profile private. But that will only serve if they ddidn't already have you in their database of 700,000 players or so.
To be honest the lodestone should be private as default. And web sites like fflogs should be opt in. No opt out.
There are so many issues with the game lately and CB3 are just putting their heads in the sand be it systems like this, or the state of the game itself.
To truly fix this problem is to take it to the source, aka getting pride of the mods that the community has made. I know that sounds like a bad idea, and I know some mods fix some issues with the game, but however, let's be honest with ourselves, modding did made some folks in the community a bit creepy and by completely removing it might allow the game game to heal a bit.
SE took action against it it have been shut down yesterday
I know people love mods but honestly at this stage they aren’t used for intended purposes like harmless fun and qol anymore. It’s used to cheat, bully and harass. The people who created this mod should be banned into oblivion and anyone who used it.
before ppl will start saying SE needs an addon policy. I'll stop this right away. Wow HAS an addon policy……..players have ALWAYS used that policy as toilet paper, how I know this? One of the guidelines is that all addons must be visible, there are many addons in WoW that aren't released to the public and have access only if you are given it. This isn't new it has always been this way and most likely this is also the reason why SE has no policy in the first place, considering they played WoW they might've known that ppl will just skirt around the rules or straight ignore them
This is indeed a very creepy usage of a mod and data, my only fear is that, if SE DOES fix it, they will combat all mods, not just this one. To stop this, I'm kind of afraid we will have to give up all mods, which I would find devestating.
Ok, I've got a hot take here.
The plugin is not a problem here and it being taken down changes nothing. It scrapes already available data anyone has access to. That means no matter if it exists or not, parsing that data is possible. This is purely information access issue on SE/lodestone's side. If you don't want data to be scraped, don't make it accessible.
Removing the repo will do nothing, because parties that might be interested in gathering all that data for nefarious purposes CAN STILL DO IT.
This is why i wish SE took a hard stand the very start of people making add-ons, mods and plugins like ACT and other tools that XIV was as advertised, illegal of third party add-ons. If this would been so like it was in 1.0, we wouldn't have these plugins.
I do not care if people say mods makes you enjoy the game or makes it better, if you cannot enjoy FFXIV without installing a lot of plugins, go play wow which allows it imo. I went from wow that I played from 2004-2012 and went FFXIV in 2011 because the add-on situation on wow at that time was getting way too out of hand and FFXIV was the new safe haven free of these things
I made a comment on another video about this, asking why this would even be needed and that it seems the developer just wants to stalk someone themself…. I got a response from a random, “ for curiosity? For the love of making something?” All I could say back was no…. Just no.
I only have 1 character, and I hardly interact with others because of crap like this, thankfully…… no stalkers…. Yet.
Agreed this tool should be banned. BOTs in FFXIV are primarily 'undermesh' BOTs that fly underneath the terrain and attack mobs from there. You don't need a tool to help you tell a character that is beneath the ground attacking things is a BOT or not.
This is crazy, thanks for the heads up dude