Just felt like sharing my opinions on this topic and tee hee oopsie i ended up talking for like 30 mins 😡 I hope you like podcasts? xD
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Chapters:
0:00 – 1:50 What is the healer strike?
1:51 – 8:34 Healing skills on other roles
8:34 – 13:52 Over-simplified DPS rotation
13:52 – 17:58 Homogenization
17:58 – 22:45 Excessive oGCD heals
22:45 – 25:57 Lack of threat
25:57 – 26:53 Recapping my thoughts
26:54 – 27:28 Will Aitherea be striking?
27:29 – 32:38 Will this have an impact? +Looking ahead
32:38 – 34:10 What are your thoughts?
Music:
Folk Round by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
River Meditation by Audionautix is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
source
It's kind of weird to go on strike when none of the strikers can even seem to agree on what they want.
It's also kind of weird because the people who would punished by the lack of healers in queues are just Tank and DPS players which aren't the source of your grievances.
well. as a tank only player, specifically a DRK one trick; my job greatly relies on the healer and their capability. i understand good healer mains feel undervalued with all the added self-healing; but honestly it's already so annoying for me to do levelling/any form of casual content DAILY. to get queued into level 80-90 dungeons with the healer not even able to keep me alive for a pull of 4 adds. and that's with me mitigating properly. you have to understand *not every healer is good,* and with basically no self healing abilities as a DRK this is torture in the dozens of daily and mentor roulettes I do when i die every 5 minutes because of the inadequacy of most of the healer players i meet, and all I want is ONE more potent self healing ability. Nobody has a problem with WAR or PLD having self heals, yet now when DRK is getting just one abillity to help with the depravation of heals/self sustain ya'll wanna not allow that?? okay.
so this movement cannot take that from us DRKs that are extremely reliant on healers and I'm pretty sure I speak for all DRK mains here. also wall to wall pulls, some DPS just cannot dodge AoEs and end up needing healing too. the constantly half HP dps having an extra self-sustain solves that for the average healer who cant juggle between the targets or knows how to swiftcast AoE heals fast enough. Healers are asking to heal more, yet most focus on DPS in dungeons. healers are asking to heal more, even if in high end duties/ultimates it will make everyone's lives easier to have one extra form of self-sustain. All this to feel more important. I empathize, but i personally disagree.
I feel like its a little premature to judge the changes without actually going through the content with them. One person's beta experience will not translate to everyone else's come DT.
The last few dungeons I've ran (only level 35) my healers haven't been healing or reviving only attacking it's gotten to the point now I'm just pissed off when I have to queue up with any healers I am only level 35 and it's not been fun so far
You also have to add the context for the dungeon clear, it wasn't just Xeno, but Arthars, and 2 others from their teams. These guys are upper crust world first ultimate raiders, they are far from the average player your going to find in roulette.
very blue mage pilled.
I personally feel they should make player targeted damage more impactful and frequent to give healers an actual reason to stop and cast a gcd once in a while.
Tbh i think being able to clear Dungeons w/out a healer is a good thing. In 4 man content having a single healer who you cannot rez is way too big a point of failure for a single member of the party. When you point out that it's fun to try to recover from a situation that's gone sideways, it's equally as fun on DPS and Tank to try to salvage a boss fight or a trash pull where the healer has died. However on the other side while it is not exceptionally difficult to do if you know your tools, clearing a dungeon or a trial w/out healers is not something that the average player is going to be capable of so I think looking at something like Xeno/Arthars/Llamatodd/Woops being about to no healer a dungeon is not representative of 99% of duty finder experiences will be.
As it stands now even tho I main DPS in high end content I almost never enter a duty roulette as anything other than a tank or healer b/c I don't want to run the risk of it taking longer than necessary.
The unique tools that Healers, Tanks and DPS have are pretty much exclusively designed for raids, and the sort of teamwork of planning out the heals and mitigation between all roles isn't something you want to take away by nerfing DPS and Tanks in favor of healers.
Dungeons kind of have to be designed to be clearable by people with limited time and knowledge and it's unfortunate that that means it's going to get boring once you know what you're doing, but that is kind of the way it has to be. Even if we get more unique mechanics in dungeons, if you're finding dungeons boring now, I promise you you'll find whatever they can add easy and boring after you've done it 20 times.
I feel like any dynamic changes aren't going to come there, they're going to come in Savage/Ult/Criterion/exploration zones/deep dungeon and your daily expert roulette is going to remain a "barely have to heal" snoozefest.
I'm striking on Jul 2nd, healer has gotten stale so much over the years, with minimum additions and no reason to push half buttons really. It's extremely sad to know that they don't even have a dev on the job team that plays a healer.
It's a shame because I love Sage and its lore/aesthetic but healer is just so boring to play nowadays. But even when I queue as tank or DPS, the healers I get are just not good at all. But at this point I'm done stepping up to do it myself.
Oh hey this is the thread that actually got me to start posting on the forums lol. I think I’m partaking in the strike. I just want my role to feel needed again.
Thank you for the video! I am part of the strike. I have a few thoughts I want to share. For the "wait and see" mindset… I've been waiting and seeing since Shadow bringers and tired of it. The lack of threat is truly real. There doesn't have to be any sort of major increase that will at least make us surprised every once in a while… I'm kinda fine with oGCD healing. At least on one healer or 2. You can have a healer that specializes in it while another healer specializes with it on the GCD. I have to completely disagree with the amount of homogenization taking place in the healer skills. Many skills may have "different" effects, but when their use case or function is exactly the same then it does not really matter if the text is different. For DPS… I do want one ore 2 of the jobs to have a rotation similar to a tank or a dancer or a red mage. They should also keep some of the healers very simple in the dps department. I also think there's room to add outside the realm of straight dps that can fulfill a similar role. I actually like your idea about self heals being on the GCD! it was an interesting idea that I hadn't' heard before. I think there's a lot of ways to make that sort of system interesting besides just removing them entirely.
If the devs are taking the directions of everyone has big guns, make healers have more offensive tool instead of keep pumping cooldowns in our kit.
The reason why healers are the only one without a rotation is exactly the reason why you love being a healer: they're unpredictable. The others don't have an interruption of their rotation, except if they die, or mechanic happens (boss untargetable etc).
Also, if you have a god complex, love saving a run/pull, but hate healer's direction, and want to jump in the bandwagon of the thread, play a PLD. Nothing would make your chest bigger (no pun intended) than covering a healer when you're just one tick away from LB3 and there's a sure death mechanic coming their way. I've stopped playing healers for the reasons discussed above. It's not about easy or hard, it's always about a more fulfilling experience playing the role.
Seeing how SQEX takes the direction of healers, I don't think they should backpaddle and make healers the backbone of the party. But they need to reinvent the wheel (or rather, triangle, perhaps) of the holy trinity roles. I know what YoshiP thinks by taking healers this way, but he didn't take the step further either because he doesn't know how to, or he's just being afraid that his concoction would flop so badly.
It's not job design, it's encounter design. People complaining about healer DPS rotations, should, as one Japanese player roughly said, "Just stop coping and play a DPS".
The core issue is that encounters are too lenient with healer downtime for the tools they have, and this problem transcends content difficulty. As someone who, unlike the person who started the post, HAS actually mained a healer in high-end, the damage going out doesn't happen often enough outside of clearly telegraphed mechanics which can have cooldowns and skills assigned after a handful of pulls.
If you look at the timeline of P8S Part 1 as an example, sure, mechanics might have repeat instances of damage, but they'll also have chunks of downtime that allow weaker regens to do most of the work. Heck, if you look at Snakes 2, between the Flamevipers and the first set of poison puddles, there's practically zero damage going out for a full 50 SECONDS.
Now, what I'd love to see are more mechanics like Abyssal Nox, Charybdis, Kokytos, Terror Unleashed, Hell's Judgment, etc, that set everyone to 1HP and go "heal now or you die", because they're great at presenting an immediate heal check that can't be mitigated or shielded.
I've seen healers sometime out damage the dps… so by the logic of this movement they should get all their damage abilities taken away.
more of a meme: there has been a healer boycott this entire expansion nobody has been playing healer and ive still cleared the entire savage tier aside from athena because i just don't care for an axolotl and the armor and all that from the final tier. but on a more serious note, i do think that this is warranted and most likely either tonight or the next few months you all will be validated just got to give it some time.
Every job needs SOME self healing imo. But you obviously should need a healer to make it through group content.
I understand the strike and support jobs needing more identity. But in my 6 years of playing ffxiv. I either get good healers that wanna perform the jobs or I get healers that just wanna log a parse and will leave dps to fend for themselves. Its why ive had to pick up Tanking in recent years to make sure if all else fails and the healer goes down I can finish the fight on my own. And I understand that's not always the healers problem but more a fundamental issue that jobs don't have much identity atm.
If dps fail their job, the fight takes longer (in normal content). If healers fail I'm laying on the floor. Many times if I'm out of position to get the healers aoe regen I'm watching my health fall to the unavoidable damage. That is when I hit my self heal. Take that away and I have no control at all over If I survive a fight. Not to mention if I do screw up and step in the orange Kool aid, I can help the healer out a little to apologize.
my biggest problem as healer is the lack of damage skills, the game is designed around the idea that the healer still contributes about as much damage as a tank, however unlike tanks we only have 2-4 granted comparativly powerfull skills but no real variety making spamming the same button with occasional dot thrown in pretty boring gameplay.
sage is the only fun healer to play giving you a bit of variety for the damage phases but even then half your skills are capped to 2-3 uses and take a long cooldown to recharge.
I agree with a lot of this. I think visual job identity is really important too, honestly that's one of the reasons I'm excited for Picto.
Viper just seems like another stabby stabby class. Very bland. Picto stands out from all the other DPS with these colorful big paint splashes that are so different from other classes, and honestly, I really enjoy that. I wish healers got more variation, color, and unique visual style for each class.
Probably still going to heal through DT though, strike or not. Based on what they've said, I'm pretty sure that they are giving out more heal and mit because the game will be a lot more punishing, though I do agree with what this post says.
Personally, I LIKE that Healers are fighting based in 14. I used to main WHM back in ARR and HW. But back then, almost all heals were gcd. We had a few ogcd and that was it. I felt like there was a good balance between fighting and healing. The reason I switched was because they moved away from the earth/air/water theme. I like the light magic but theres no balance anymore.
I think that if they only removed Bloodwhetting's ability to heal WAR "once per enemy hit" and limited it to "one heal per GCD", healers would be a lot happier.
WAR would still be extremely strong, but at least they wouldn't make healers completely unnecessary in w2w pulls.
It's insane that they even let that skill slide. It's so unbalanced that it almost looks like a coding mistake. Like they meant to only have it heal once per GCD instead of once per enemy hit, and then just left that mistake in there…
Idm the healer boycot, means even shorter ques for me as healer
I don’t want to lose Vercure and get nothing in return. Us red mages are supposed to be users of white magic just as much as we are damage dealers in lore and I’d like to see that better reflected in our gameplay instead of getting our hundredth finisher…
I'm a healer main – I agree with much of what you say.
Especially your opinion regarding the healer dps.
– i'm of the same mind there.
I dont want more dps button
or more complexity regarding healer dps!.
However i'm also aware that many healer mains wants just that ( more dps buttons, complexity)
and i think they should get their wish also,
We have 4 healers,
There is no need makeing all 4 healer jobs the same ( complexity/difficulity(DPS)).
(Examples) Like:
SGE: Already have great foundation to be more dps-oritated healer (be more complex dps healer).
WHM: Should stay simple
SCH: Be e simple, but have some of its DoT's back
AST: idk(?)
About the first point, is it really that big of a deal for other roles to have those healing abilities? With recast times of 60 to 120 seconds, this seems to be a lot of time to wait in between without a healer. So i always saw these as more of an emergency/panic button rather than a reliable healing source.
I main DPS so I really don't know. And there is not dungeon or trial where a healer hasn't saved my sorry behind 😁 So please don't go on strike
I think if they gives us so much heal, it's probably for a good reasons, solo instances for one, the game has been focusing on it more lately
As a scholar enjoyer i am hype for the change they made tho
in my opinion, I don't want complex dps rotation but I really want a complex healing rotation instead. If Healer is given a dps rotation then they are not gonna heal and will only focus on fitting their dps rotation in burst windows which is really bad in they long run. Personally I think Sage is easier than White Mage but that is how I feel. Also if Sage stop our Dosis, it is actually a healing loss due to no Kardia healing so.
People are looking at the wrong things.
Increase everyones hp and increase damage of mobs and how often they do it. This way healers are needed because no non-healer can concistently heal the way healers do nor as much as.
This game has already all the job design for this. Healers are op. All we need is to raise the hp and damage to match the tools that healers have.
#MakeGCDHealingAMust
I feel like I should point out that only the top players are actually able to run content without healers. I've been playing 14 for about 2 years now and 90% of the parties I wind up in don't have have that capability. Case in point: I had a Mt Gulg run earlier this week and the healer openly admitted to not knowing what they were doing (level skip). Guess what happened. We died. A lot. Even with a WAR as tank.
As I been playing this game along time I can tell you we need more self sustaining abilities considering 99.9% of can't do there jobs anyway I literally had to pick the tank and the healer up they really should get rid up these job roles in dungeons
You complain cuz your another egocentric healer afraid us dps and tanks going to take your job you probably don't want to do
I've died a lot because the healers are more focused on dps than healing, so I can understand why healers feel undervalued