Today we’re checking out a video from WillE on FFXIV A Realm Reborn.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdVeN1Xp3Qc
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I loved ARR recently started EW took me close to a year to reach here but i dont care is a real fun game stoiry is 10/10
12:02 i experienced the game in a time where you had to level 2 different jobs to have the next, better job 😀
that was a great time, i personally loved it ^^
and yes, i played the longer ARR version too 😀
This guy is a hack journalist and a bad faith actor who just wants to say "WoW still better than FF" even though every metric proves otherwise
Don't waste your time on him Ruri
When people say that people are "finally giving it a go", keep in mind that actually, a lot of people moved over to FFXIV years ago. There has always been an exodus to FFXIV from WoW. Zepla moved over during WoD/Heavensward. I moved over during Stormblood when HeelsvsBabyface put out his video on the game. Ruri came over during BFA. WoW lost over 10 million players from its peak to Shadowlands. Most people already left the game. The people who are moving over now from Shadowlands are the most addicted holdouts who stayed with the game during the worst years, while most normal people already left multiple expansions ago. The people who have WoW brain formatting that are coming over now have 15 years of WoW brainwashing to undo so its not easy for them to stop thinking about things in terms of WoW. Its not surprising that someone like WillE is still so mazed that he's comparing ARR to a fricken Halo campaign.
The way you talk about cleaning the map and how it's WoW formatting is kind of putting it wrong imo. You make it sound like WoW is the exception that pushes you to clean the map while in reality every MMORPG other than FF14 does that. Naturally when every single big MMO has that playstyle, you will think that cleaning the whole map is normal and try to do so in FF14.
Every expansion had parts that were boring to me, yes even Endwalker. I can understand why there are parts in the Story where not much happens (to let the emotional players catch their breath) but the story could have been shorten without any problems.
It is interesting how people defend ARR and how people can dislike ARR. You see this is sort of personnel for me. I have for many years been trying to find something to play with a friend of mine. When we got into ARR and went through it he was fine. Until he hit what I called the “100 quests of hell” aka post ARR patch content. He managed to make it through all of it.. we were just starting heavens ward and he just quit. I mean not like oh ill try it again later quit. I mean wtf. That was a huge waste of time. I’m not willing to put any more time into this. Hell around Christmas I was talking to him about it and trying to get him interested. and he said I can’t stand that game it waisted my time and I couldn’t stand the gameplay. Because of that I have been trying to figure out what was wrong with ARR for him to quit to the point where he would hate the game so viscerally. Yeah, it was slow but why would he have such a reaction.
Now mind you this is a person who plays games hard. he doesn’t like half ass, if he can number crunch and grow, he will have fun. From Street Fighter II to Disgaea games he will play them if he has growth. He loves good stories, FFVI, FFVII, and FFX being his faves. He is the whole reason I got into playing JRPG’s in the first place, which again is why it is personal. I really wanted him to experience this game but that initial start left him so angry he can’t forgive the game. And yes, he holds grudges, to the point he will not purchase games from certain companies even if the game is good. His preferred Total War Warhammer race is the dwarfs because they are like him and have a book of grudges.
As I thought about It this is what I came up with. I think ARR has a gameplay issue that isn’t a deal breaker but affects people who want to play the game for story and character power growth. You see in most JRPG’s which ARR emulates you would go meet person x and then run to person y to get more story/world building. Now while running between person x and y you would have the random battles. These battles would give you an opportunity to fight monsters, gain money, and loot. Normally in many of those JRPG’s that was a key part you would grind away to build your char, get stronger while learning the story.
In ARR what you had was an ability to skip most of those monster fights in the world. Unless explicitly added to the quest you could avoid them for the most part. I would guess that a large portion of people would in fact get annoyed when they were about to click on the quest marker and some sort of monster agro them. So, they would kill the monster because it was in the way. Then do said quest marker part… read / do story. Move to next marker avoid non quest fights if possible. rinse repeat. Now before everyone jumps up and down going well that’s the game. just think about the difference between JRPG above vs ARR.
In the JRPG standard you would have a continual growth not just in story but in character when moving from point to point. Ie, main character is important to the story, and character is getting bigger numbers and feels more powerful. Up until the end of the initial part of ARR you have that growth of char getting stronger “stat” wise i.e. more powers opening up and exp bar move as well as story. After though when you hit what I call the “100 quests of hell” your story continues but character numbers become static. Now I am not saying they were trash, but it was hellish to go through for me. You see it felt like I was just an errand boy at that point. I would run from point a – b. then something would happen. Then off I would go again. yes, we were building the world, but it never felt that interesting to me at the time of play. Wee off to location, help x get more stuff. Ok now they oversee things cool ok now help them do y, ok now what.
You see the quest line was building a world and the payoff would be amazing, but I never felt a sense that it mattered until the very end of ARR’s post patch. We were just passing time it felt like. Between that and the lack of “stat” growth made it feel more like a visual novel than a jrpg to me. Basically, the story felt slow.
I think if I was feeling that way my friend was probably losing his mind. For him his ability to manipulate a number, person, or object to increase “power/stat” is integral for interest. It is why his company created the business analyst position for him, his mind is all about growth, improvement, and efficiency. Its why in games he was a monster to play against to the point where no one will play against him anymore and will only play co-op. I am the only person who now and then will try to go against him in any sort of competitive way. and lose a lot… I mean 100 match and get maybe 10 wins level of losses. I think the story had gotten so boring for him he stopped paying attention. So, when the big payoff occurred, he just didn’t care. Probably in his mind it was ok so princess moron got played, guard dumb ass got angry and lost his arm, and your team were caught up in a trap like a bunch of morons. only people who seemed to have any sense were the guilds. Why would I want to continue to play with a bunch of moron characters? This is my best guess on his thought processes. could be wrong but after 20 plus years of knowing and gaming with him that is my best guess
The thing is, in the expansion I think they vastly improved that balance. if you look at the point where you stop gaining exp.. the story seems to ramp up much more during the post patch content. That post patch content is so exciting and crazy that though your characters numbers aren’t going up. The growth of the world and char are so large it doesn’t matter. Also in later patches the team didn’t feel like a bunch of people who would get played at every turn.
I feel that is one reason why people dislike ARR. You are not seeing the big growth of event leading to the huge payoff in an amount of time that felt reasonable. Instead, you were dealing with a much smaller set of issues that in the end paid off with a moderately larger issue and those small little items were important to that pay off. From a story point that is great, unfortunately from a game play point it didn’t feel that big and can lose people in a bad way.
I am wondering if people had not said hey it gets better how many people would not make it through that content now. Ie.. you come into game and have no friends to say he dude just wait till Heavenward, if you’re a player of not just story but also stats how many would just say hell with it. Which is sad because to me this is one of the great games that truly should not be missed.
13:00 Just being blunt? Imo ARR is still better than anything WoW has done story-wise. Not to even get started on WoW Classic. I'd rather spend hours grinding an interesting story vs. grinding for Zhevra hooves or prowler claws.
Saying "get through ARR to get to the good stuff" isn't an implication that ARR is bad, but that everything after it is really good. I think people get confused about that.
ARR is cool/average
Good if you really enjoy a good story-based game
But from someone that comes form a high-paced hack-n-slash game like WoW is understandable
The thing I don't understand about when people say that ARR is the worst one, is that it's literally the first experience in the series. It SHOULD be the worst, b/c as the game evolves and xpacs come out, I would hope that it gets better as the dev team grows and learns each time. Like…I would be mad if the 3rd or 4th xpac was worse then ARR, b/c I want the series to grow constantly with each new xpac being better then the last one. So yea, I'd say ARR is the worst, but being the worst out of a bunch of amazing content still doesn't mean you're bad.
I started FFXIV in October as my 2nd MMO ever (i played quite a bit of runescape back in the day) and I just can't understand how people can say it's boring or there's a lack of content. I'm still in ARR even now months later because there's just so much to do. My friends that got me into the game are actually annoyed at me being distracted by all the non msq content lol.
I think it's not unfair to say that ARR is definitely the weakest portion of FFXIV. It is very important as it sets up the rest of the game, but it is the weakest portion. Doesn't make it bad per se, but not as good as the rest.
this one time some years ago when Heavensward was current content, people in my FC were randomly talking about Thancred, and one person who was max level said "who's Thancred". We all got sad after that lol. I still remember that today
nice. you are actually earning doing dailies cause you do react vids. lol keep them coming.
What is the biggest complant gamers have right now for the Western Gaming Market. Paying 60 dollars for a 5 hour campaign and being told to play Multiplayer constantly to pad out the price on top of buying game passes to access content that was chopped off in order to milk the customer.
FPS games in general are slanted heavily towards Multiplayer over story. This guy really doesnt understand how to do a correct comparison and there's a big reason why so many players flock to JRPGs over Western RPGs because the value per dollar for the story is there.
it seems he is looking for confirmation from his audience to justify boosting and he'll do it
Gave up on wow back on bfa as well, as soon as i realized the covenants restriction bullshit i knew that their philosophy didn't had changed a bit despite being on the "we hear you players" when it comes to shadowlands content.
Also on the completionist front, if you told WillE that an MMO had a completion time of 40 hours- what then?
People that are newer to FFXIV maybe don't realise the story behind ARR, trying to limp 1.0 over the line and actively developing stuff to make it playable whilst developing a full MMO in a mere fraction of the usual development time means some things like pacing are amiss. The best part of going through the expansions though is seeing the increased budget, and therefore VA quality, and them just getting better at what they do which permeates through everything. By the time you get to Endwalker, ARR seems like a distant memory, but the threads of story started there are not thrown in the trash. I know it isn't for everybody, but anyone who complains about the story should really get through it and at least see Heavensward, to see if they like it as the narrative really improves from there onwards.
Edit: 10 hours is ample time to see if you like a game, except when it comes to MMO's. 10 hours in an MMO is absolutely nothing, so I disagree with WillE there.
i just started a fresh character to refresh myself on ARR and the rest of the MSQ. Its not that bad. ITs better than most if not ALL of WoWs leveling and story. If you can get through World of Warcraft you can get through ARR.
That rushed mindset comes from being instilled with fomo from other games i think.
It's that some people don't understand the difference between bad, and disliked… if most people say something is bad, it's bad, but a few people can still like it… if only a few types of people say something is bad, it's disliked by a few people, but not bad.
Coils are almost 2h queue time for me have only done 2 of them since i cant just "waste" 2h of the day off when im having so much fun with the msq, seems its something i will have to do later
I agree with WillE's general point: if you have to spend 10-30 hours to get to the good stuff, why bother with that game?
Where I disagree is on the assumption that the first 30 hours aren't good. Here I agree with Ruri. After the first 3 hours the game was good for me. It just got waaaaay better after 30+.
IF the game takes 30 hours to get good, it sucks. If it just gets better after 30 hours, that's fine.
I cannot fathom how WoW players see the first 30 hours of FFXIV as chores you have to get through, but saw the constant grinding that is the first 30 hours of WoW totally fine.
I'm not even saying the grind in WoW was bad, it was fine. But pretending like the levelling experience of WoW, which is fetch quests incarnate, is somehow better than 30 hours of an actual storyline is just mind-boggling to me.
I'm glad that games like LoL, WoW, and all the shooter/single player games mentioned in this video exist for the kinds of people who would never read a 900 page book if something amazing doesn't happen in the first few chapters.
it sucks they cut out some funny parts of some quests..,
had even seen someone have the gall to say that they liked the idea of the scions having adventures without you.., when you are part of that adventure..,[ie sylph shenanigins with whonis cabbage, who is thancred.., THIS IS THANCRED]
[THERE ARE SO MANY PLOT POINTS OF THEM HAVING SIDE ADVENTURES, JUST LIKE SOME CHARACTERS SIDE DETAILS BEFORE SB]
I think a big thing people who complain about ARR don't consider, in WoW you had established lore all the way back to Warcraft Orcs vs Humans. ARR is the world building that WoW essentially shipped with.
As someone who has never played an MMO before, FF14 has been an easy experience for me as I breeze through ARR, Heavensward, Stormblood and am only now moving on to Shadowbringers, even after 30 days of in game time played I still find myself with no intention of speeding up or rushing to the end of Endwalker as the I've personally never understood the idea that some how rushing to the end of something with make things better not that I do not understand the important of end game activities but If we take the example of any other rpgs or jrpgs we usually find if not always find that the journey is more important then the destination because once a story has ended that's it, its over there's not continuation button. I think it comes down the simple tale of the tortoise and the hare, the hare focuses on the goal only thinking of the everything that comes after, paying no mind to all the things that passed them by, an once they reach the end of their journey they question if it was worth it and without the memories to back up the experience they'll be left with no reason to continue, on the other hand the tortoise with his slower place takes his time enjoying every step and all the people he meets along the way so that as his journey comes to an eventual end the tortoise can look back on fond memories that he has made, an know that journey for him was worth while, now not everyone will or can be a tortoise but at some point everyone looks back on life realising that reaching the goal is pointless if you did not enjoy the journey there
its great! arr wall keeps certain people out
If you sing the praises of Classic you're not allowed to bitch about ARR. You're really not. It took months to get to level cap back in Vanilla. There was no story. It was literally collect x from x' or kill 'x' all the way to the point where the game literally ran out of quests and you had to mob grind. There wasn't even a precious "endgame" for a long time either. Some classes were literally not even usable due to how useless they were. Ret paladin was the most boring class to ever exist in a video game ever. You literally auto attacked while AFK refreshing a seal every like minute or so. lol feral anyone?
I get if you don't like ARR, but you can't trash it while praising fucking Classic…not and have anyone take you seriously, anyway. You didn't have to read anything in classic because there was nothing to read. You close the quest text and go kill the bears. That was damn near the entire game aside from dungeons here and there.
It's like saying season 8 of GOT was the best and that the early seasons were shit because there weren't enough explosions and there was too much talking and it was too boring. Like you can think that, but no one's gonna take you seriously. I wish Blizzard would give these people some content so they'd go away for awhile.
Haha I remember when I first played through ARR, back during the Stormblood Days. Was quite a bit of a slog, but the worst part was having the "Road to 60" Buff during the Post-MSQ. So annoying to get to like 55 but never getting any of the new Skills to play with, not to mention the Anticipation for the 3 new Jobs you can get in Ishgard – which then sent you back to 30 xD
As someone who's first PC experience and game was WOW, I played for around 7 years and when I got to WOD I was pretty much done. I felt something changing after Mists of Pandaria, not that I didn't like the content. But I felt a shift in the mood of the community, and in the overall lore. After leaving WOW I tried many other games, free to play mmorpg's, single player experiences like Skyrim, the Witcher games, and I tried ff14 not having really played their single player games. So I didn't know the lore not that, that ever stops me. On the contrary I find it more interesting going to games blind, Final Fantasy 14 took me Three attempts before I'm finally hooked. So I understand people struggling with the base game, but once it hooks you then your in pretty much for good. I also play ESO due to Skyrim being one of my most favorite games, which also has strong story and interesting side quests. It however unlike ff14 doesn't push as hard for you to do the story as much, but you then also have players at end content…Not really knowing what it is, that their doing or why. So while you do have to do a lot of reading, and watching of cut scenes I do think the pay off is well worth it. However if your not into reading or story, these more story focused games are just never going to be your thing. Nothing wrong with that as such, your just going to need to find something that fits you better. And with a plethora of games already made, and being made every day. There is always going to be something for every kind of player.
Its not really wow mindset, but gaming lately tbh, u could have seen in genshin as well, monstrr hunter as well and other game, ppl tend to focus on endgame as main game, to be most efficient with all guides, looking up all possible information and follow up the guide so u can be done with and not waste time,
the hunt to play what other player are, to compare with them, and the satisfaction of being able to compare how bigger ut PP has grown, meanwhile ffxiv and many other game doesnt put such comparism to their game but player still look for such (example genshin impact – pure single player without any PvP and fully clearable with starting character, but ppl still look for dmg efficiency, calculation best setup etc,)