Changing how you approach these five things in combat might just make you an even better tank!
Why Tenacity is Terrible: https://youtu.be/stgUbtFKu74
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Music Used:
FFXIV Endwalker – Cradle of Hope
#ffxiv #endwalker
Chapters:
00:00 Introduction
00:57 (1) Using Defensive Cooldowns Exclusively Reactively
03:26 (2) Standing in the middle of the AoE pack ignoring Positioning
07:46 (3) Neglecting Defensive Cooldowns Because YOU Think You Don’t Need Them
09:42 (4) Not Using Sprint to Not Stress the Healer
11:57 (5) Arm’s Length and Low Blow
13:56 Fun Fact
source
a thing about arms length, it doesnt work with WARs vengence due to vengence dealing dmg to those who deal physical dmg to you so it does the dmg over applying the slow thus making arms length useless if you combine it with vengence
This applies also to WoW mostly what you said cause mobs move a lot there, but one thing i transitioned form that game into this one is to use corners to gallop all monsters, if there is no corner just walk to the ones that are ranged and pile them up. And don´t be afraid to use BURST DAMAGE, the more damage you dish out the less cooldown you need to use later on. The quicker the enemy is dead the better it becomes.
Probably the saving cooldown one is that gets me the most when i heal, cause some tanks are SUPER AGGRESIVE and don´t try to use cooldowns at all.
Not packing mobs into one blob is frustrating for DPS. Its waste of AoE cooldowns and much slower.
Thank you for making this! I'm guilty of only CD reacting sometimes lol
This is your most helpful video for me personally. I'm new to tanking and the main question I had was the first point you addressed: Should I be cycling mitigation or holding onto it for when my health drops?
As a follow up question, what order should I be using the mits in? I've been starting with reprisal then using rampart after, since reprisal has the shorter cooldown so I can get it back sooner after using my other mits.
I feel like after heavensward, a lot of this should be learned through osmosis, unless you don't care because I don't pay your sub
something to note is that arms length on a warrior while vengeance is active will not apply the slow when you are struck by a enemey target, it seems to be a bug or an unitended effect…. just something to keep in mind for anyone that plays warrior.
I have 6k hours in the game. I'm not learning anything new.
Finishes video: Stunning is that effective?!
When I first started tanking in this game, being a long time tank in other games, I had no clue about the limbo game that healers play. When I heal, I will purposely let tanks get low so that I can use a long CD OGCD full heal. So I would suggest to tell tanks to trust their healer until you have reason to not do so.
Oh, here's a tip: Tag enemies with your Tank ranged attacks (Unmend, Shield Lob, Tomahawk and Lightning Shot) while you're moving a pack, this is very useful especially on long pulls where you move mobs a long distance (like in Troia for example). Cycling through the enemy list and tagging them with these attacks will guarantee you hold aggro through the pull since they generate extra enmity, which in turn allows Dpss to use some hard hitting stuff they might have as leftovers from previous encounters (and that would otherwise be lost) without pulling aggro. These attacks also deal a bit of damage which helps in speeding things up a tad in the process
Number 1 takes a good deal of time learning, especially if you're coming to FFXIV as someone used to FF games and unfamiliar with MMOs. Generally in single player RPGs, you use abilities when you need them, as they cost resources and resources are finite. It also just takes a long time to even get enough defensive cooldowns to really think about using them more proactively. When all you have is rampart and reprisal for a good chunk of ARR, it puts you in the mindset that you have to be REALLY sure about when you're using it. So a lot of tanks end up not using it, especially when you have aggressive healers. Ironically, great healers tend to make tanks spoiled. Especially sages and scholars where they can mitigate a decent chunk of damage for them and they might not understand that that's what's happening.
We do not make mistakes, we are ones #tankyouverymuch
Is it too much to say "use your skills. both ogc and gc"
Okay, I haven't seen that often, compared with other slips such as forgetting tank stance, but a few times I've seen the tank pull the mob, really well, using mitigation, rotating, getting all the mobs in a single spot, and then stand there doing auto-attacks. Like they were saying: "I got the agro, you guys do the kill"
It is not unlike healers who only heal, not using damaging skills.
Just rarer.
Your videos are so informational, I really appreciate it. FFXIV has been my first MMO, and I started the game as a tank. It got to be too much pressure, esp with how weird and bossy people can be when you're a tank. Ironically, I ended up finding my calling with healer classes instead, but I'd still like to play tank from time to time because I think overall they're enjoyable to play. This answered a lot of my questions! My biggest problem as a tank is overthinking everything.
However, I do have a question! I noticed other tanks using their long-range attack while they're pulling, so I started trying to mimic them. I didn't realize they were toggling enemies to keep enmity until this video, which is so smart! Problem is, I play on controller, and trying to toggle while running is really awkward without full-stopping for half a second.
Do you have any advice for how to make that process easier?
One thing that many players also doesn't seem to know is snapshotting. It's one of those hidden game mechanics that if you know about it you'll be like "ah, so that how it works."
I actually have a question believe it or not. I play Gunbreaker (I only specify because i don't know if other tank classes approach what i do differently) and one habit i have is, that during bosses i don't avoid certain attacks indicated by the "cheetos dust" unless it is multi-hitting like several "dusts" focused on one point or those that need the group to be together to reduce the damage.
Anyways. My point is. Because of skills such as heart of conundrum, Aurora, Rampart and Brutal Shell i often feel like thhe damage i take from these attacks and, of course, the Vulnerability Up debuff don't phase me as much because of my Self healing. However, after watching this video i am now wondering if i am actually doing bad by not caring to dodge and not accumulating stacks by putting a strain on the healer. For reference, during a NiER raid i had actually accumulated 12 Vul stacks and did not die but now i wonder if it was because of my self healing and mitigation or because i made all the healer have a heart attack and divert all their focus on keeping the suicidal GNB alive so the rest of the team would not die.
Thus, my question is this, is not caring to dodge attacks to keep the damage going and the boss attention on the tank a viable strategy or am i just making my healer to work overtime desnececerally in keeping me alive and not causing damage to the boss even though i do have the mitigation and self healing to keep me alive fine enough?
A small thought from an old player (like, "My name's in that hour+ long Meteor Survivor List" old player, in my case, XD) — sometimes you'll find tanks and physical DPS not touching their sprint because the long-seated memory of Sprint eating your entire TP bar to fuel its duration, so sometimes we old players fail on point 4 for that reason, as Tank or as the DPS alike.
As an extra for the Arm's Length slow, it is not just auto attacks, but cast speed as well, so if theres some mobs that cast a bit too fast to dodge sometimes, if they have the slow debuff it also takes 20% longer for them to cast it or just… stay still w/o attacking for longer on long casts
I, um, might have occasionally rescued a tank over to the ranged mobs in a trash pull.
Lately when tanking i have seen huge influx of dps players who throw everything at the first pack during wall to wall pulls.
Then after they get aggro they start raging about it yelling me to provoke while they stand out of range where the first pack was 1v1 fighting some mob. I mostly play on ps and controller and i seriosly think i should make some macro to explain them to bring enemies to me so i can aoe them or even be in range of provoke.
Tanking is all about consistency. All these tips fall back to just setting a precedent, and following through. You're meant to be the stone wall so act like it LOL.
I find most inexperienced tanks put too much importance on trying to "re-center" the boss or face them True North in situations where it's not necessary (excl. Savage etc). Given that most bosses will just re-center themselves, you're better off following the boss to the new front until they move themselves. Melee players are not waiting for you to move the boss again, so you might as well adjust and keep the boss facing whichever way they jumped to until the phase change etc. Again if you do this, or don't, just BE CONSISTENT.
Also you should never be tanking a boss against a wall, as you are likely to be completely negating the flank positionals.
Sprint is the only thing I disagree with, because most tanks abuse it and don't implement it properly, or don't consider the dungeon layout itself. A lot of bad tanks pop sprint where they get zero use out of it, and arrive to the mobs with it falling off between the two pulls and taking chunk dmg anyway. It also negates that the rest of the party killing the add before it reaches its destination is ALSO mitigation. Smart casters can also utilize sprint to get a little ahead of the pull and do more damage on the run instead of uselessly just running beside the tank. Sprint is not a catch all solution and probably the most useless of these otherwise great tips. If you're going to use sprint at all, you should be popping it strategically and not just on cooldown. Sprint is a situational button because layouts and mobs vary, and I agree that you should be more aware of when to use it than how to push it.
Algorithm gang!
My biggest complaint about most tanks is that they almost never communicate. I know you've covered that before, but my first time playing high level healer with a DRK tanking I had no idea what they were doing when they popped living dead and I was wasting all my resources on them because I don't play DRK and don't know what the effects of living dead are. If they had just said "Don't bother healing me until (xyz) happens," I could have had a much better time of things with that run. Clear communication should be the highest priority, even if it means stopping for a second to type.
Noob Tank here, Ty for your video!
I came here for tank tips, but that section on mob positioning has turned me into a better dps. My flares will finally start hitting whole packs.
One i seen while lvling reaper recently is the start and stop pulls. Start pulling and gather everything you want to. Don't start and stop again and again. Waste a lot of dps big moves
My favorite Tank faux-pas is not using any mitigations for large trash pulls in a story dungeon, and then "kitchen sinking" at the boss, including their invuln (which could have made your life as the healer a lot easier if they had of done that 5 mins prior when they were near-death during the trash pull). But I do not complain or even say anything unless left w no other option (Basically, unless I am forced to defend myself against certain accusations). This is the unique challenge of Duty Finder: heal tanks w no mits and DPS who are either unable or willing to move out of AoE's. I heal them all without so much as a peep.
The weird part is when you have another melee or two and none of them use their stuns either.
Been playing for years and never noticed that sprint thing
Being afraid to pop sprint because the healer might not do the same seems a bit silly, because you can always just slow down a bit if the healer gets far enough behind that you might be in danger. It's not as sprint is some kind of forced march. Whenever I'm tanking a dungeon I always pop sprint before I start pulling, but I make sure to keep an eye on the party frames to see if the rest of the group is doing the same and adjust accordingly.
I can think of one tank mistake though it only considers Dark Knight: using all your MP for offensive. A 70+ DRK should always have 3000MP available for TBN. Can't tell you how many times it has saved me from a pinch.
One tip I always give to newbie tanks that wanna try their hand at bigger pulls is to always use atleast one AOE skill after their ranged attack to pull a pack, I've seen so many starting tanks just, use their ranged to pull a mob and run past the rest of the pack, leading to them losing aggro as the party attacks the mobs that weren't "pulled" by the ranged skill
These can make the difference between healers wanting to group with you or not.
I was a popular tank because I was known for being easy to heal.
That didn't mean I didn't push things, it just meant I actually used every damn button I had.
Trying to please your healer is generally a good mindset to have as a tank, but you also shouldn't treat them like they're children.
If they don't like what you're doing, they'll tell you.
Well… Some of them do.
There are really stupid tank players who think they only need one defensive cooldown…how pathetic…
Cooldowns are your friends folks.
As a Healer if you don't use sprint, I will rescue your slow ass into pulls.
6 mistakes. Not putting on tank stance is pretty common. I've done it, you've done it, everyone has done it. Freakin' capped stuff removing it is so annoying.
For me, I usually pair a 'major' mitigation with a 'minor' one when pulling W2W. My go-to is usually Rampart + Arm's Length for the first W2W, Tank-specific + Reprisal for the second (rinse and repeat if there are more than 2 W2W instances between bosses), usually floating other defensive cooldowns where appropriate.
That said…I am kind of guilty of number two sometimes. Although not always.
I must admit the title scared me at first, I didn't realise these were like "common mistakes" or "what you can do better as a beginner!" so that was a bit of a relief.
Once I saw the tips, I actually think you're super on point about new tanks not learning to use their defensive CDs and holding them too much – which can definitely be a problem, rather than just getting the casts out there and getting them back off CD. Also the sprint tips were awesome and the Arm's Length as a defensive was a good bit of maths and calculation to finish the video off! (also I chuckled at the subtle dig at WHM's Holy AOE stun and diminishing returns on CC at 12:46 lol)
The more I learn about tanking in FF14 the more I’m learning I’m not the worst tank in the world but I’m not a good tank precisely because I want my healer to not have to stress over me so they can focus on babysitting the dps. I need more practice and to just full send it. Not play this dancing game. I need to know what I want to pull and to fully commit to it.
I actually forgot that Arm's Length applies slow. Thanks SO much for that little tidbit. I'm usually really nervous about tanking, since I'm mostly a healer main, so I want to check out the tips to see if there were other ways I could improve or at least start to feel a little more confident. Thankfully, most of these tips were things I was already doing, so it eases my mind a little.
One of my fav "Oh shit!" PLD moves if I pull to hard for my healer is doing a Shield Bash+tab+low blow+tab+shield bash in quick succession. In the span of one GCD you have 3 stunned targets and a decent amount of damage reduction. If the healer is still struggling I'll drop a shield bash on every other mob that hasn't been stunned yet. Is it optimal? Who knows. Its super entertaining when your incoming damage suddenly goes to zero though XD and its fun being creative.
If a tank is slow pulling instead of doing wall to wall, a mistake a tank makes is moving onto the next group BEFORE finishing off the group you're currently fighting. We miss out on some non combat perks by doing that, such as general hp/mp regen, or specific abilities like NIN who like to use hidden out of combat to refresh their mudras.
if you spin the boss willy nilly im going to cry <drg main
Just dont use vengeance alongside arms length.