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Thanks for addressing your concerns, been posting mine on the official forums but that place is a mess. So many people bring up the mobility tax, which is so dumb for reasons you stated and also because mch has the worst mobility of the phys ranged role. At least the pvp itteration feels like it was well thought out. I really miss our old turrets ngl.
Just make wildfire a party buff similar to trick, a seflish rdps makes no sense anyways
I agree machinist atm is week I can feel it also.
I would like to see MCH to get some love and a boost in DPS but it is not too concerning to me. I feel that MCH is a floor DPS class because it is easy to play and the key thing about MCH is that our damage is consistent. In my static I am in last with the four DPS slot however I am usually first or second in PF. This is because while other DPS classes in PF can tweak their play style and have a bigger range of DPS, MCH and other phys range has only really one play style. The reason for this is I think of how easy MCH is picked up and doesn’t have the movement limitations of a melee or caster. Agree with some sentiments that MCH should be boosted up and above some other phys range because of how “selfish” it is in terms of providing raid buff so our raw DPS should be higher than other phys range.
I do agree that melee should have more potential overall but that mobility tax or ranged tax thing never really sounded convincing to me since Shadowbrigers. At first it seemed legit but then I see SMN everytime and it suddenly doesn't make any sense.
I can see why the devs are reluctant in over buffing the MCH because it's a ranged dps, their mobility and lack of positionals will dominate the other classes. What I hate is that they stripped MCH of all their useful party buff utilities.
The MCH tax is because they can bblast from pull 1 on every boss with 99% optimal rotation. It's probably one of the easiest classes to play currently and that reflects in the rDPS. The reason classes with buffs have somewhat higher rDPS is because otherwise the avarage party would be so much worse with raid buff classes.
I believe machinist will get a strong buff in ……………………7.0
I think that they should buff Reassemble to provide extra potency to the skill it buffs on top of it being an automatic crit+direct hit. This makes it so that it doesn't boost the other jobs with support skills while increasing the MCHs own personal DPS.
We need to drop the fallacious arguments about mobility or uptime taxes. If this was an actually balanced thing, all jobs at percentiles 75 and above (even below tbh, the charts don't swing that widely there too) would be all perfectly equal and balanced on rdps charts, because those come precisely from actual fights where uptime is actually already compiled into. Yet all melee and blm jobs still perform better in numbers, even after fight uptime shenanigans.
Mch needs debuffs that are similar to dnc and brd buffs. So maybe a def down or crit resist down debuff. I’m sure it could be balanced.
MCH definitely needs to be treated like a selfish DPS and should at least sit above BRD damage-wise. There's one aspect of MCH that i think SE needs to lean into and that's making Wildfire the highest dmg ability in it's rotation (when executed properly). I haven't fully examined the numbers, but from what i remmember, Drill, Air Anchor, and Chainsaw still do more damage w/ reassemble than a perfectly executed Wildfire and that honestly just sucks lol. Especially considering that your entire rotation revolves around lining up with that ability every 2 minutes. Should be more rewarding than it currently is. Even after the potency buff. Just my two cents as a MCH main since HW
what needs to happen is one of a couple of things, remove range tax all together for them and buff potency to match red and smn or be slightly ahead (probably wont happen), add gauss barrel back and buff to be equiv of BLM, add a new skill something like "anchors" that mimics the idea of leylines and stops all movement until damaged (dps higher than blm during anchor but lower without maybe tie it into heat gauge) or add a combo to air anchor -> drill -> chainsaw that has a chance of proccing but reassemble ups it to 100% so it more relies on you understanding burst windows, or change wild fire back to the old version(stores a percentage of the damage you deal) and possibly make it party wide(iue x% of all party damage done gets stored and dealt at the end) so that as a ranged they have no party "buffs" but they still use the party for their damage(could be an interesting rout to take if you want to keep ranges more party focused give mch a bunch of party focused thing that aren't buffs but are effected by the party)
In terms of ceiling the machinist is still lowest, yes. However most players can't play it at the ceiling. Machinist's median is higher than the other phys ranges, and in the 10th percentile it's even higher than red mage. You don't need to play your best to keep up with the average player, you just need to be average.
If they've buffed it once they can do it again, im sure it will happen one of these patches
Mmm, what percentile is that graph referred to? Is it from the top percentile? And if that is so, is that really indicative of how good the job is doing? From the All percentile graph on FFlogs machinist seems ok positioned, actually above bard and dancer, if we consider the medium and upper percentile (and even at the lower percentiles). It's at the very top that the machinist starts losing ground considerably compared to the others, but again that could be hinting at the fact that top players are not really playing the job. All of this just to say that maybe things are not so grim for machinist after all :).
Range tax? that shouldn't be a thing anymore, most melees have gap closers that are x10 better than just walking like MCH, we do not have any mobility except sprint and that is something everyone has, casters except BLM are literally range dps cuz they almost have no cast anymore (look at smn that thing barely cast now) and Melee uptime? most of them have almost always true north not or something like it, they can now do range attacks without loosing combo and so on, range tax is a thing from the past and i dont know why they are so afraid of it.
machinist should be on par with a melee. change my fucking mind. make their rotation slightly less forgiving to compensate. no fucking reason a job that brings no utility to the table shouldnt do respectable damage because they have about 2-5% more uptime than a melee playing just as optimally as them.
It’s sad to see how machinist is rn in PvE.
Especially sad considering how awesome it is in PvP, better design and better performance. Such a shame.
I think the job’s design is the issue. It’s fundamentally flawed. It relies too much on good ping, perfect weaving and resource management, and offers no utility. It’s damage spikes also don’t line up well with fight mechanics and raid buffs. You have to put in more effort for less reward. Literally every other job is more beneficial to groups.
I know some people like the design, but I think many overlook or just tolerate the issues because of how cool the animations and fantasy of the job is.
The thing people are forgetting is that the "selfish" jobs shouldn't be top rDPS at very high percentiles. If they're still better when the team is fully synergised then the buffing jobs have nothing to offer. The issue was that MCH was TOO low even at lower percentiles.
The uptime argument against ranged dps is so stupid. The vast majority of fights have strats that allow for nearly 100% uptime. Ranged dps get punished for no reason
It's refreshing to see the ideas that people come up with to make MCH better while keeping it selfish, because let me tell you, it sure gets old seeing so many people wanting SE to just turn MCH into another utility class. (because it's not like 85% of the job roster already brings buffs to the fight or anything) Literally defeats the entire point of being a selfish DPS. Hell, as is, it already brings more utility than SAM and BLM, just by virtue of having a flat 10% damage mitigation across the board, rather than a 10%/5% split.
Honestly, just tweak the potency on Heated combos, Wildfire, and Drill-adjacent abilities so that MCH is above the other ranged physicals, and I'll be golden.
There is a huge part of mch dps contribution that is not visible with rdps, indeed, you can get 100%rdps while contributing way less than a 90% mch that still manage well its ressources to fit in the raid buff given by your party. Rdps deosnt consider all the bonus dmg you bring by destroying the boss during burst, it might be not enough to make it top, but a great reason while on fflog, mch skill cap seems so low… Its because its not visible
I really wish this would go into more data, since I'm looking at fflogs and saying mch is 300 dps lower than the next job doesn't look correct to me, just going off fflogs.
At the end you claim that machinist doesn't outperform an average skill level player on dancer or bard, but this is false. I'd love to see what data you used to reach this conclusion, or a correction if you realize the data you are using does not support this claim.