Quazii reaction to โThe FFXIV Community Has a BIG Problemโ by Lynx Kameli โ link to OG video below.
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#ffxiv #finalfantasyxiv #ff14
OG Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-qn0y-UL0w
0:00 Realities of Being a FF14 Content Creator
3:40 The Concept of VOCAL MINORITY
6:00 Personal Attacks Are Not Okay โ But Do Not Feed The Haters
12:25 WoW vs FFXIV Communities Respond Differently To Criticisms?
15:52 FFXIV โExtreme Hatredโ for WoW Refugees?
22:13 Personal Opinions are 100% Great, BUT That Does Not Invalidate Others Opinions
26:10 Compromise is a TWO-WAY Street
30:15 Idealism vs Realism: Yoshi-P Cannot Do It All
35:50 Feedback is Constructive Only When It Is Realistic
39:00 4 Concluding Thoughts
source
Lynx sucks lol I remember beginning of covid he was pissed at SE cause of lack of content in the middle of a pandemic like they need to stay safe as well
There will always be bad apple. But i believe the majority of ffxiv player are just tired to get bad review of the game by people who didnt try it. I dont think ffxiv player will be toxic on people who did try and didnt like it even if their opinion are different but if you skip story, did only norm dungeon, ect.. just dont say the game is bad because you will get some hate comment.. be honest and say you didnt really wanted to play at all.. since 1.0 the game have been push down "in majority" by wow player as a "weeb game", an "easy game" or "shit game".. i believe with time, player got frustrated of that hatred that they get easly eritated.. still there no reason to threaten other but i believe it could be a reason..
The thing with Asmon though, is that he swung at the FFXIV community. Now that he wants to play, would the butt hurt people REALLY let him off the hook (which some people did and some people didn't)
I think the better example of the toxic community recently is Brian, from Work to Game, fighting against the "FFXIV Defense Force" to get his opinions across.
You nailed it right out of the gate. Social media makes every community look bad.
It starts to get aggravating, not just because people who disagree with something are more likely to comment, but because social media companies purposefully do this to communities. They use algorithms to elevate and bolster comments with certain insults or the traffic indicating arguments in the sub-comments. It increases time people spend there, increases traffic, increases profits. People are getting fooled by these companies, then blaming the community. Blaming people who don't even know about the arguement in question because they had too much fun ingame to find the arguements or were too busy touching grass when not playing.
And Yoshi P had the same opinion you did on unsubbing. He's told people he'd rather them unsub than having an unhealthy, stressful habit with the game.
Wow, his section of the video is called "FFXIV players hatred towards WoW players". No, thats not really true. As a matter of fact the general consensus is people trying to dispel the notion that all WoW players are toxic and to give them a fair shake. This video comes off as someone just trying to play the victim, and when you want to feel victimized, its very easy to find things to feed into that mindset (especially if you are a content creator).
Edit – "I love the skill based action of MMOs"… My guy you play WoW and FFXIV. Tab targeting MMOs require little to no skill besides "Can you keep pushing buttons while not dying"
its hard to be toxic in ff but i do it as much is allowed for example, if im sprinting on cd in dungeons and a dps is using dashes to get ahead of me to pull shit and doesn't bring the first pack to me and just keeps going well oops my tank stance turned off : )
There was a recent discussion about community and toxicity in my FC and my takeaway was that yes while there may be toxic positivity in FF and healing in FF also generally sucks (healer main in WoW, cant stand it in FF), the majority of people tend to be more positive and give the game a better atmosphere, and, in my opinion, there is no competing with that.
I really don't get the compromise thing. Does he not realize that, when you're in a dungeon with a new player, you're rewarded more than you would be normally specifically so you can be nicer to the new player and go a little slower for their sake? That's exactly WHY the game gives the group a "new player" bonus…
I don't get it. The comments shut Lynx down? How? Did they ban him from uploading videos? Did those mildly irritated comments break his legs or something? Bro, upload whatever you want. You can have whatever opinion you like, and you can even be super wrong or inflammatory or whatever if you want. The only one stopping you is you, Lynx!
EDIT: LOL, "I'll get cancelled by the FFXIV community" god what a fucking goober. Just say what you feel man, Jesus Christ.
"Toxic" is just a word used by people with no self-esteem. People with self-esteem don't even notice so-called "toxic behavior" let alone complain about it.
You're totally right; but since you are my favorite MMO content creator, I just wanted to mess up the ratio a little bit. So this is a comment which has no emotion or agenda behind it. Well, other than wanting to see more Quazii videos. That's my only agenda. Take that, angry internet commenters.
Lynx is tragic. He had valid points but he caved under the pressure of opposing opinions and instead of delivering calm, logical rebuttals, he just devolves into a toddler throwing a tirade because people aren't cow towing to his playstyle or lobbing trophies at him for being so brave for putting his opinions out in the open. There's a right way to handle things and a bad way to handle them and in this case, I'm afraid to say is an example of the latter. People have a tendancy to agree with people who look like they can keep themselves together as opposed to people who become unhinged at the first sign of pushback.
Asmon kind of did this recently. He blamed the community for pressuring him to play the game when in reality I think he just got bored of the MSQ. It was pretty obvious. The "community" is a convenient scapegoat for a lot of content creators, but you nailed it when you said that they only focus on a vocal minority. There were so many more FF players that just wanted to see Asmon play through the storyline, they don't care if he played every day.
I think the story is really good but I think if someone skips it, they're not missing anything. I started to skip MSQ CSs and dialog around lv20 MSQ and each expansion and patch, I try to start reading it but I stop after maybe 4 or 5 quests and start skipping again. I've criticized the game (mostly how the glamour system is shit and the increase to 800 slots fix absolutely nothing and various other things as well) and each time I did, I felt like I had to leave my FCs (which i weren't to attached to after I left the one I was in for over 2 years). I even said how FF11 has been systems for some stuff than 11 and I even had the FC ldr tell me he put a link to a private server in the discord, just for me, while I'm still subbed to FF11 to this day which I found as a "shut up and leave". The whole "unsub if you don't want to play" argument I think is also crap, when I unsub, they have no reason why I unsub.
This is a comment from a minority, if youtube didn't use this as a metric for boosting content creator frankly I would be too lazy type a comment.
Yeah if you want to delve into the toxic side of FF community, you should do some research on ScottZone. The guy got death threats emailed to him, detailed ones including his home and work address. And why? Because when Eden 1-4 released he said "This was pretty underwhelming and doesn't feel like a lot of raid content to have for 6-8 months. Maybe they should increase it to 5 fights". The guy had to give up streaming and content creation because of the stress the death threats caused.
I haven't really ran into many toxic players while playing. I have ran into a few who clearly play Savage content and then go into the roulettes as if expecting others to match pace when at that point you could be playing with new players who are doing the MSQ or haven't touched the content in a while. This was a tank who apparently thought we were "too slow" and quit after he pulled a whole level of adds and put strain on the healer as he was a warrior who wasn't using his self sustaining abilities as much. Play however you want but still using courtesy when playing with others specially when they have a sprout next to their name. It's a game and we should all have fun.
I enjoyed Lynx but 100% understand why he isn't making content anymore
While you may try to counter the argument of negative vocal minorities by pushing the concept positive actions done by the community. This is honestly a smoke show to simply ignore the fact that a discussion regarding the games glarring issues simply is difficult for many to swallow and why you don't hear much discourse about FFXIV's failings or missed opportunities. A toxic minority of a game with as massive of a population as this, is still a sizable number of people who can't stand to hear anything bad about their flower child of a game.
When I heal I love tanks who ask me if big pulls are okay, even if my answer is always heck yes pull everything and then some more. It shows they care about other players and not just getting out asap for their cheap tomes.
ive never seen any toxic person in FFXIV since 1.0 until the day that shit head came in and brought all of toxic shit heads with him ๐
oh where lynx at now he fell off
I think you are also missing the point. YOU as a YouTuber get hundreds of comments, and while its great you get more positive than negative, this simply isn't the experience for those who have a more limited reach. I've lost friends because I didn't care about 14's story and thought the game needs to work on certain gameplay aspects. Just speaking about it to my group of friends, a few of us have splintered simply because MSQ is life and they can't hear criticism. Love it or leave is a more common mentality than you wan't to admit.
Lynx sounds like a hypocrite.
You're a very mature person Quazii. Respect.
The dude sounds like he hates the Massive Multiplayer portion of an MMO.
Thing is, i don't think lynx has the empathy that you have, he never liked the MSQ and he found it boring as well as the leveling progression, so he would not really understand if someone wants to take in and enjoy a new dungeon content that the sprout just unlocked. Efficiency is his enjoyment and taking it slow for newbies is not efficient.
I feel there is alot of projecting on the FF14 community from people in the wow community. I think people Asmons comment is exactly that… have you seen people react to Quazii or Preach when they critique wow? Reddit threads. Forum threads. Hate threads. Youtube comments. The WoW community is EXTREMELY defensive against any critique of their game. The idea that they will agree with you if you critique is wrong, because you're dealing with only the community that does believe in that critique and not in the community that will dump massive 300 page hate threads on you. ((Cough cough, yet more hate threads on Bellular for example))
The biggest problems with FFXIV is this fake forced positive toxicity that the community shoves down peoples throats. We're not around some campfire singing kumbaya. We have A LOT of issues that almost 10 years later are still not addressed. WoW refugees are not a problem but it's the wow refugee mindset most us of us are tired of and it doesn't help that Yoshi P is trying so hard to appeal to blizzards customer group at the expense of the 1.0 community and ffxi community that kept this game alive during its darkest hours. At the same time you can enjoy something different but it's pretty obvious that you're playing an MMORPG that's storyline driven so the wow refugee mindset or view is invalid.
the more passionate and larger a fanbase is, the more vocal they are.
the majority of the ffxiv community do not watch these kinds of videos. a couple of dozen youtube comments harassing him? sure. but there is millions of ffxiv players.
Quazi! NoNONONONO. Do NOT read comments while on your balcony! One of those lovers might say something that will make you want to jump! All of those people out there that somehow think people give a shit about what they say!
On the topic of FFXIV players hating WoW players, refugees don't count as WoW players since they're no longer WoW players, but have gravitated away from it for one reason or another. This makes them a lot like me who when looking to get into a MMORPG I looked at Blizzard and their monetization and lack of care for content, and I decided to play FFXIV.
I view WoW players in a similar light to those I have of Diablo: Immortal players, but to a lesser extent, as the monetization is disgusting, but to a lesser extent than DI. One pays for power for their ego, and the other gets milked for the opportunity to grind a new zone in hopes of one day raiding mythic.
If people promote Blizzard games I generally do find hatred for them, but just knowing they're WoW players evokes pity instead.
The FFXIV player vs WoW player comparison didn't make any sense.
Yes, if you tell a WoW player the game sucks, they'll agree. Because it sucks.
Try telling them that you like artifact power, or conduit energy.
In fact, someone go make a Reddit thread saying one of these types of things. Liking WoW's controversial features is where you get the hate and the backlash. Go fuckin' say hi when you enter a dungeon in WoW if you want to see what a completely broken and busted community looks like. If you talked shit about WoW back in its hayday it was a very different than today. Because the game has been on a long downward trend, liking it has becoming less and less popular and less accepted. That's why you have streamers who "keep it real" vs the "shills." It's the exact same thing they claim about FFXIV players, but in reverse.
Since I grew up playing MMOs in the 90's, it was common to bounce around (Ultima Online, Everquest, Asheron's Call, Dark Age of Camelot, etc), and it wasn't until WoW that people just started to really dig their heels-in. Seeing tribalism in the genre is still weird to me, like you're beholden to only one game, and that was the key difference seeing the surge of new players coming into FF14, hearing that they only played WoW and no other games. Some of them doing it for 10+ years, I have trouble fathoming how. It sounds like that was one of his big complaints that there was not enough content to sustain that kind of habit.
With that said, I view FF14 as any other MMO I have played, and all his arguments lean heavily into niche complaints, namely the raiding scene; however, his stance on new players is horrendous, especially since the whole point of being kind to sprouts is to help foster the community and to help with player retention.
Thanks as always for the content, you big WoW hating shill
Lol "How are you going to say anything bad about FFXIV?" Me: Talk dumbass
Bro, the community of FFXIV is MILLIONS of people strong. If there were that many people coming after you for negative stuff then you would not be keeping a youtube channel XD
This guys video sounds like a "woe is me" video. He definitely sounds like he's whining. If you like a game, shut up and play it, and don't whine about the minorities – as Quazii said. That island sanctuary comment though XD 10/10
I didn't think that first comment was toxic at all. I think they're confused about what toxic is.
So he gives opinions but he doesn't want opinions?
Hiyaaaa, just ignore these haters Quazii. They are really not worth your time-la. Focus on the positive parts and just do what you always do, create and have fun!
14 is toxic,.example
The comments here.
1 thing is for sure, You're unable to make a negative remark about 14.
You should always do wall to wall pulls even if somebody in the party doesnt want to do it. Just because there's a sprout doesn't mean you can't wall to wall. They're not confident but they have to take that step eventually. So pushing a player to do a bit more is helpful. What's the worst that can happen? The party dies? Then just respawn and try again.
Wall to wall is the fasted and most efficient way to finish the dungeon. The problem with going slow is that everybody's time gets wasted. You can't treat all compromises as equal. It's a small ask for players to simply play the game and not be afk pressing 1 button every 10s. It's a small ask for players to wait a bit on the cutscene that only takes up a tiny fraction of the dungeon time. It's a big ask for players to have to double the time they spend in dungeons by doing single pulls and having the healer refuse to press a damage button when the tank is taking literally no damage.
Having discussions about the housing system and how to improve it runs right into the toxic FFXIV fanbase… and I wouldn't be surprised if there is a correlation between the people trying to shut down that discussion and the RMTers making a living wage off of the housing system.
This sums up my thoughts on Lynx's video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-qn0y-UL0w&lc=UgwEMG_DwmBcFMsWJMR4AaABAg
as someone who enjoys both FFXIV AND gardening, your comments regarding toxic feedback and a gardening channel hit home – I'm likely one of the very small minority, but it was particularly funny for me. I really appreciated though how being a content creator is a lot harder than most people appreciate given all of the feedback that most people never realize that you get
Quasii your not a rank 10 island thrall like me? Go back to wow ๐ lol but really keep doing you ๐
So I started playing 14 about 2 years ago, and I've never played WoW. I had a few good friends who played WoW and they were some of my best friends growing up. About 6-8 months after playing I left my FC because of various reasons and I started to look for a new one. After a bit of looking around I found a small FC that welcomed me in. I quickly became good friends with everyone, they helped me with various content farming mounts, Bonzja, Eureka, ect. After a few weeks they asked if i wanted to join their static and learn to do savage raids. All of the players in that FC are EX WoW players. Moral of the story never judge a book by it's cover. No matter where you go, what you do there will always be hater, there always has been and there always will be. Brush it off and keep walking my friends life's to short to be hung up on pettiness.