FFXIV What Level of Player Personal Responsibility is Expected? | Work To Game
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What is the minimum level we should expect for a player in Final Fantasy XIV to go to to play the content? And how can we add systems to improve on that personal improvement.
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The only thing that's ever irked me apart from the obvious, are healers who don't have to heal so they just stand still and do nothing, or do a dance emote until they choose to heal again. It just feels insulting to everyone else who's at least TRYING. And they're the one who can't even do that. I don't expect anyone to even be a 'good' player, but I expect you to at least press buttons. Especially since everyone else is managing to do so. It's not demanding healers to do damage even, but when choosing to NOT heal, they also choose to not push any buttons at all.
I always thought they should have a job channel for hardcore content like novice network. By switching job you switch to the job's channel. New endgame players will have direct access to the experienced, altruistic players. Boom problem solved. :3
I try to read my tooltips, but I don't always understand some of the moves, so I'll usually start with the most BASIC of options and then add others to my "frequently used" list as I get around to figuring them out. My issues begin and end with other players presuming a level of competency that I don't have… yet. And there's that yet that causes all the problems.
I was a brand new player on my first ever character running the Snowcloak lv 50 dungeon for the first time ever maining White Mage and I got the ABC lecture (Always Be Casting) because I wasn't comfortable with juggling DPS with Healing when I already knew how quickly things could go south if I wasn't paying attention. In all seriousness, I hadn't even been playing the game for a full month yet (possibly only a few weeks, to be honest) and my FC was STUNNED by how quickly I had worked my way through the MSQ to that point. It takes years of daily play to build up some of the muscle memory to be able to juggle some of these things and I was the newbiest of newbies. I could keep their butts alive, but I didn't need to be lectured about contributing damage on top of that when I wasn't sure I could do that AND do my primary job in the party.
Guess who no longer Heals? Yeah.
I've always had extreme Tanxiety. As a consequence of that, I've habitually stayed away from Tanking simply because I didn't want to ruin someone else's experience by being an idiot. (Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria is a true stone pain in my backside on the daily.) I'd just started learning how to tank and it HURT when Healers decided that I wasn't going fast enough for them (because, again, Tanxiety meant I went more slowly to make sure that nothing went south because I'd already been on the Healer side of those situations) and decided to use Rescue to force me to double or triple pull when I wasn't certain I could hold a group that big AND I wasn't really sure I could risk telling the group that I wasn't comfortable with it.
I end up stepping away from Tanking for days to weeks when stuff like that happens and if I'm away from it too long the Tanxiety takes hold again and then it's a fight to go back.
Granted, the "bad runs" are relatively rare, but still, they happen and they leave scars.
How do ppl survive without reading their tooltips? How can you stand going into content not know wtf your abilities do? If Iâm going to play with other ppl Iâm going to at least make sure my gear isnât trash and I can perform at least ok against a striking dummy. And thats for dungeons. If Iâm doing an Ex, Iâm playing my mains at my best giving it everything I have.
I was doing the relic quest for the 6 dungeons antitower first tank new player lvlsm skipped tank to 70 me healing yelling at him to tankstance and to attempt a cooldown
2nd tank same thing but i chose to let him die cause im a dick lol
3rd tank great tank till he dcd had to dancers they go should we wait i said i can out heal the dmg they laughed then said sorry lol at the end lol
I expect and tolerate pretty much anything in light content. until you get to endgame raids then were gonna talk more.
I think a lot of people forget that FF is not the only game most people play and they don't have infinite time to play so they aren't interested in practicing rotations for an hour or more everyday to get to a decent level. I fall in that category, I try to do my best but I don't have the time nor the interest to turn a game into a job. Because practicing rotations is boring as hell so I rather have fun or play something else.
I level all jobs/classes. I learn them as I'm leveling them. When I hit 80, I look up rotations and I practice them. However, I don't have any expectations of those who I end up in a group with. It's not my place. If we wipe, I offer advice, laugh emote, then give A cheer emote. I make sure that I do my job while making sure I do what I can to maintain a friendly environment.
On the other hand, I'd like to say fu*k your expectations. If I could meet them, I would. I do my best to learn and remember everyrhing I can do to be the best in that group so I don't care about their expectations.
Everyone is not going to know everything about a job. If you see something that can help a player, tell them in a good way. I sometimes wait until after the dungeon because I dont want people feeling confronted. I only offer advice during a dungeon if we are wiping or I sense the environment changing for the worse.
I think it could be improved by changing the game to make it harder to do your rotation wrong, or at least explain what the rotation is meant to be without having to piece together information from separate tooltips.
I'm not sure to what extent this applies to other jobs, but for DRG there's a basic 1-2-3 combo that starts off the rotation. It would be easier if something simply stated that you should do those 3 abilities in that order. Or even better, don't even let players do them out of order. Maybe even make things simpler and have it so there's one button for the combo instead of needing all 3 on your hotbar.
You could say that just takes some of the skill out of the game, but really what skill is involved in pressing 3 different buttons in order? Having one button you press 3 times barely makes the game any easier.
I'm a pretty casual player, so maybe there are reasons you'd want to use those abilities out of order, but if there is then the option to do so should be considered an advanced feature.
I could see a fighting game style training solo trial to help teach rotations and things but if someone really is so lazy they canât read some tool tips and practice a little bit are they even going to engage with that content in game? I mean I think that figuring out how to play a job and learning it on my own is what makes jobs fun in the first place. If you just put in a thing that tells you what to do and when, wouldnât that kind of take a sense of accomplishment? I could be wrong about this or just in a small minority but I donât think this is a needed thing. At some point the players need to take some responsibility for their self and do their homework.
Me: Wants Chris and Brian To MENTOR half of us in our goblin FC. XD
Also Me: <_< i turned the tooltips off because it was hard having to read everything the middle of a dungeon
Reality Also Me: I only did this because at this stage of playing Bard, MCN and Samurai – i know 50-75% of the generic rotation, and can say that Bard and MCN i know more than SAM – but honestly, HONESTLY HONESTLY – Samurai i just need to relearn the kenki related ones not the 3 seals but the MAJORDAMGEU ones that i keep unlocking lol
Just to throw out another perspective: I normally play my Bard in group content and I'm pretty good with them. I hardly ever die. Run the content over and over until I can do it in my sleep and know my rotation (and I use that word loosely because..well, bard) just by the timing in my head. No need to ever look down so I'm pretty competent.
I'm not the best by far but not the worst either. Then I had to take a break for almost a year because of medical problems which I'm still dealing with and I'm nowhere near as good now….at least on some days. Some days I kill it while others I just don't feel good and have one stupid death after another. It's been kinda up and down lately but my health has been getting better and my play is slowly improving again. So there's probably a lot of factors for a lot of people on why they may or may not be good on any given day.
Man when I saw the thumbnail I read "Fixing Boobs". What is this clickbait? I want my money back. Maaan.
I think they should have a test run or a dummy run to learn rotation and have mentors host those to see what can be improved on Or use target dummies in a room that scaled like a raid boss.
My stance is as this: When you go into a roulette, it's a trade-off situation. You're being offered a reward by the game (tomestones, EXP or whatever), and in exchange for that, you're saying, willingly: "I am putting myself available to be picked and matched with anyone at random – LITERALLY ANYONE – that might need people to help them run some specific content they need, or so they can get some tomestones too.
The emphasis here is in the word "ANYONE AT RANDOM".
That means you willingly accepted to be paired with absolutely anyone. Note that there aren't any "but"s in this. It's not anyone BUT <insert criteria here>. It's absolutely anyone. And anyone can absolutely mean a 8-year old child who plays by smashing their keyboard. It may mean someone's significant other trying out the game for the first time in his or her mate's account. It may mean a mother of one who's running the dungeon while at the same time breast-feeding her baby. It may mean someone whose main game is not FFXIV, has no vested interest in ever running high-end content, and see no reason to apply hours of study and learning into improving their playstyle. It may mean ANYONE. And THAT'S what you're signing up for when you press that "JOIN" button at the duty finder.
You're not getting those tomestones for free. You're not getting those tomestones simply for running the content. You get those tomestones as a reward for GIVING AWAY YOUR TIME TO OTHER PEOPLE, WHOEVER THEY MAY BE.
It's a matter of mindset. You're there for them, not the other way around. It's not your place to put expectations on the other people running this with you.
personally i think it should be ok to excpect someone to do good enough in their role to do the content and have the tools to see where it goes wrong, somethimes there is just a good way to do something and a wrong way the important part is the way you help someone get better.
I like to teach new players the combat jobs however, I do get snarky and fed up with players at level 80 and theyâre refusing to do base actions (biggest problem being no heals from a whm). Really when ppl play their jobs extremely poorly like they hadnât even done any of the job quests to at least learn the ropes I get very annoyed đ
I just do what I want now, if itâs not good enough for some people thats fine.
I did it for a month and realized it was a boring and unfulfilling way to play.
Edit: if the only thing you control is you then why stress it? A wise man once told me that itâs just a game so save the stress meter for real life issues.
Cant stop watching your content. Such a great conversation
I thought running around in circles pressing random abilities with no clue what any of them do is what DPS are supposed to do in DF lol.
I really like and respect the way you guys approach your channel and audience with well thought out and mature opinions, I will make one point though as it's a pet hate of mine. The idea that people learn better by various methods depending on the person whether it be reading or watching etc… is a myth and I see it a lot. The human brain and it's ability to understand and learn is a very well studied subject and in the field of education and tutoring it's well known that experiencing and doing something is far superior to listening to explanations or reading about it. Watching something happen is far superior to hearing about it happen, I forget now the exact percentages as it's been a while since I studied this, but the difference is vast. It's something like 10% of what you hear you will remember, but 90% of what you see you will remember.
As a result the best way to learn a new dungeon or raid is to watch a video on it and then go and play it. Listening to an audio guide or reading a guide is vastly inferior to that as a teaching or learning technique. If my job was to teach people how to play this game I would show then a video guide, then run the dungeon and give prompts to remind them of the guide when they started to struggle. I would absolutely not sit them down with a written guide or just try to explain it to them and people claiming they can't learn from a video guide and have to go in blind probably can't be bothered to watch the guide or don't want to because they enjoy the blind experience.
I read the tool tips, but I have a learning disability that makes it difficult to fully understand what I'm reading. I'm a very strict visual learner. So, words like aspected, and unaspected make zero sense to me.
When I unlocked DRK, the quests were freaking overwhelming. I decided to take on lower level dungeons and when I felt comfortable, I'd do higher level dungeons, rinse and repeat.
11:44 That would be me, lol.
I definitely agree about reading your tooltips and knowing your skills, but there's a whole other side of personal responsibility that wasn't covered: knowing the fights, which is important for everyone but especially tanks and healers.
I'm new to FFXIV but an experienced tank and healer from many years of other MMOs. I don't step into a dungeon or such without watching a video, so it floored me the other day when I was healing and we got to the boss and the tank asked, "any mechanics I should know about?" It's not our job to educate you on your job and teach you this dungeon. Small tips are one thing, I have no problem with that, but we're not here to teach you each boss when there are many videos that will do a better job of preparing you than we can. Please prepare first, other people are depending on you and expect you to have a basic idea of what to do in this piece of content so we can get through it.
None. Itâs a game. Not a death sport. Not a professional sport. Not a job. Itâs a game. The odds of you, if youâre a verified pro hardcore player in this game, running into parties that consistently get you wiped is slim at best. Focus on your game. If you die, oh well. Dying is actually part of the game after all. And, yes, after you finished reading this; itâs still a game.
Some people have their own rotations which they learn from experience but don't end up utilizing all their skills. Are those players worse than those who try to find the perfect rotation for maximum output? For me, as long as we kill the boss and survive, I say we all did good.
I think a good solution would be to have battle challenges with some sort of decent loot incentive where you have to solo a dummy or boss or heal ext and if you can complete it then your doing enough dps or healing for your lvl. And in return you can get gear for your lv or and emote ect.
if you play a critical role without basic knowledge of your class, you deserve the amount of poo slung your way, what ever it may be. other than that, just be better than the last time. if on new mechanic your brain goes OOGABOOGA! and it results a catastrophy, at least show that you now understand how you fucked up. second fuckup on the same mechanic is taking the piss.
in normal content there should be no expectations. if you're in upgraded content like extremes or savages or whatever, you are expected to know the game and your class and understand that fight really well in the normal capacity so that if anything, you might need a small bit of coaching on the differences between that content and the normal version. you shouldn't have to tell a tank to turn on his aggro or remind a healer to use Regen or explain how a stack mech works or anything like that in upgraded difficulties. and if there's a dps check, you're expected to hit the mark needed to cover your price of admission. if there's 8 people in the group and you're a dps you better be hitting for at least 12-15% of the groups damage. biggest problem this world faces right now is the sensitivity of everyone and the feeling that they are obliged to be given access to everything whether they belong there or not. participation trophies. time to get back to business.
I know some of this resonates with me. When learning ninja I didnât know that hide resets my Ninjitsu cool downs until a video I was watching telling me that. The tooltip basically changed under me and I never realized. Also having groups of people to talk to, I had been in the novice network and now that I no longer qualify for it I miss the conversations in it.
What if there was like an "Uber" system for getting personal help from people who are willing?
There is already this training system. i had to run 4 as dps, tank and heal. Why not have the same system train and learn you your rotation not forced nescessarily. It could even be like you had only 40% uptime on your dot for this boss encounter average among summoners is 85% here's a training course you could take. and if you have that it needs to also give you the carrot so it could just keep being like you performed well in this specific instance, compared to either yourself or others of the same class.
Starting above level 1, you can't expect everyone to know every ability. I don't generally read tooltips, however even when I did, they had changed the text because I was synced. Level 77 samurai before I learned I had positionals