Now here’s a topic we discuss often and I figured I’d react to this Josh Strife Hayes’ video on FFXIV vs WoW. People always say only WoW can kill WoW, I have a different perspective.
Go follow Josh Strife Hayes! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3d0is45Ing
00:00 – Intro
03:12 – The time to kill
04:13 – The “endgame” brainwash
06:49 – Nostalgia is king
09:58 – FFXIV is growing!
13:51 – WoW can’t even kill WoW
19:08 – How can WoW kill itself?
25:35 – So many FFXIV players!
28:20 – WoW players just want endgame
33:13 – Conclusion
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#ffxiv #wow #reaction
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You are fundamentally wrong here – i have a friendlist of like 150 people, i lost almost all of them (werent online for month even years). My Guild, a guild of 700+ Members – we had around 40~50 people online usually, it is a dead place by now…Finally i quit because no one was playing anymore. It was sad to witness it… but it is the truth, WoW is dieying slowly.
I played since Vanilla and it is true there is an emotional binding to this game, but its worthless if you have no one left to share it with! Right? And that is happening right now…
Needless to say that i went to FFXIV and found a thriving community, friendly people, always stuff to do, awesome story & systems and it even look better (subjectiv i know).
And now think about it – Who did this? It was Blizzard itself.
btw. i am a long time FFXI Player myself – Sesono @ Asura Server. I played that game for 15 years as well, even log in nowadays here and there. But the people are gone… and FFXI is dead as well. Also, the community became a toxic bunch >_<
And one last thing!
A NEW RAID IS OUT! People stay at FF14 and my guild is still empty from what i heared. You said it yourself – FFXIV is as full as if a new addon just released. Sprouts everywhere.
WoW wont kill itself in a year or two from now but the decline already started – big time actually.
I’ve played wow since Wotlk expansion and that’s all everyone wants to do is end game. When you complain about it to ppl they all say well everyone cares about the endgame, but then we have a drop of 41% bc when they rush to end game they get bored quicker than most people that play the game and take their time.
I believe you're too much focused on the literal meaning of the death of a game.
Nobody of a reasonable level of logic, will think that wow's gonna die this way.
There is always going to be a dedicated fanbase hovering around the game no matter what.
When we're talking about its death, we're talking about how the game will turn from number one best MMORPG of 17 years, to number 2, to number 3, to eventually being just another MMO out there.
The idea is that wow's killing its status as the king of MMORPG. 10 years ago, barely anyone would bother even giving other mmo's a chance more than a week tops, and back to wow again. However, now we're seeing people leaving wow permanently.
And unless wow bounces back and understand what it's doing wrong, more and more people will leave. It won't kill the game. But it'll lose its king status. Which honestly, I think it's already getting there.
Tfw number one MMO for years and years suddenly in danger of being number two is pretty big.
And my god, Jagex is just a way better company than Blizzard. Straight up
Bwana don't get it Really don't get it when ppl say wow kill it self we are humain we stop playing at Moment we die we have Money problem etc.. but here the thing MMo need New player not only the old same ppl and if wow don't Get new player Your update will slow down and if u slow down u lose money and whit Cash shop that is P2W at this point You have everything for wow to kill it self and when say kill it self we are not talking about Not single person login but going down to lvl of Gw2 or archage
I think you are imagining people talking about WoW floundering as some final, absolute, or clearly delineated thing, of course there will be people who will never quit WoW, that is irrelevant. Even obscure "dead" games have some die hard players left always. But WoW has been loosing people for many years and they are certainly making decisions to loose more. You talk about the rise and fall of population with content, but notice those peaks get smaller and the valleys get deeper over time. Just because there will always be some lifer contingent fraction, doesn't mean its enough to keep it on top of the genre. Floundering doesn't mean the servers shut down with no one there anymore and the game disappears, it just means it becomes less and less relevant until it increasingly passes more into just niche status whether they can keep it going or not. With other games getting the spotlight and majority of interest.
The only person that can kill WoW is an executive leader that gets skittish concerning lost revenue and pulls the plug manually.
hello 🖐 good video
Great points, wow has a lot of these players by the balls. A lot of them will complete the FFXIV msq and run back to wow when they start comparing the end game. So eh; both mmo devs and the customers (players) are to blame for the state of the mmo genre. Everyone just flocks back to Wow, or stays there (their massive population makes this a fact); so new mmos never try anything new (risk).
Outside of FFXIV being so great my dream mmo would deviate from the wow formula. It would be much more open world based, with many channels (to control server overload issues). Kinda like FFXI or Everquest in terms of open world. And it would have hundreds of open world events, then thousands over the years, then millions over decades. Unexpected, expected, and player created "events" is my dream mmo.
In an events-type mmo the community has to work together; the server comes together in a fluid way. Again, think of Everquest and FFXI. The problem with XI is how they took difficulty and grinding to extremes; 8 hour bosses should never be a thing. But outside of that it had amazing open world events/systems. Bozja and Zadnor is a great step in that direction in XIV but my dream mmo would have that everywhere in the open world
If WoW would still grow would have they stopped announcing Sub Counts no they want to keep the optics, make no mistake about it WoW's playerbase is declining and not at a slow pace it keeps accelerating quickly in 2020/2021 in my opinion.
The Survive thing really hits me, I loved Wildstar, and it absolutely burned me when they closed it down..
Recently started playing FFXIV and am having a blast after not playing any MMO for a few years. I keep having a reoccurring thought about wanting to get back into WoW because FFXIV is piquing all of those old MMO memories. Nostalgia is a powerful thing.
What we have and are seeing are how many non raiders/PvPers were hanging on in WoW well after whatever drew them into it has gone. Those are the people that are susceptible to leaving.
I'm just going to say this. Everything Bwana is saying about WoW was said about Everquest.
Edit: I can't prove this, but the vast majority of players can't devote time to more than one MMO. So in many cases, a +1 for FF14 is in fact a -1 for WoW. If they keep going like this, all that will be left is those mythic raiders, and you can't have a game with just them. EverQuest also had to learn you can't have a game with just the most hardcore players.
5:12 and they were right.
I think the first premise is wrong. If you pick up the Glory, one day you will have to put it down. That's WoW in a Nutshell. They were eager to Claim #1and King. And no King Rules forever. They have to put it down one day. And that's why People ask what will kill WoW, well… because it can be.
Final Fantasy took a Different route.
This is us. This is our roots and our direction and beliefs. We are going to improve ourselves and game. It was never a Fight with WoW. FF devs didn't fall into that trap.
Thus, FF can never really be Killed. The reason? Because it never picked up the Glory. FF re-made a Game that was just "them". So expansion after expansion it wasn't a question of Are we the absolute Best/King of MMOs?
Their Mentality was – did we improve our Game, did we do better than ourselves? Did we stay true to who we are and want? Did we do just to our Fans? And is it Fun? You can never lose as your self because through and through you were urself and nothing more. That's because what they offer isn't themselves as Kings, but as devs that want to see you have fun. And at that Marker they can and are succeeding. It's easier to Fail as a "King"
the king of terrible and not thought out takes
That's the thing I like about ESO is that there's no real "push" to get to end-game. I spend most of my time in game running around doing quests. I que up for random daily dungeons and the three other daily dungeons for undaunted, if I get some good gear with a good set bonus, great. If I don't, bfd. I won't be in the real "endgame" of ESO like trials and vet dungeons for a long time and I'm in no rush to get there because there's no rush in the community for it.
If you actually played wow you would see its slowly dying. Especially the community and Blizzard not having a good relationship at all with each other. Its obvious. At the same time FF14 is growing. Both are true. Its a perfect storm. People are tired of it. Its been too much. Not just the game but the false promises and for me, the boost in TBC killed the game and there are simply not the right kind of players playing the game anymore. At least not enough of them.
No, not everyone will leave but thats not the point. The point is alot are and will continue to leave. Thats the whole point. That has been happening and is getting worse. Its obviously getting worse. Year after year, its been getting worse. Yes people come back but not everyone. There is plenty of evidence of this. People are leaving.
A dead mmo generally does not mean no one playing it. Wow wont "die" but it will be a walking corpse. The addicts of wow are no different than those in any mmo. If you think the glam addicts in FF14 are any different you are highly mistaken. There will always be those players. The rest of the players are leaving however. Its obvious if you actually go look.
And btw. You say they will come back but also say you are seeing new sprouts everywhere. Who do you think those sprouts are man? Lmao come on.
I enjoy the lore of WoW but not the game anymore, I'm not a hardcore raider and I'm not a fan of all the systems. I tried FF14 but only got to lvl 30 as a bard/archer. I may give it another go and try a different job.
I think this is first time I see you are being consistently wrong about things… No offence xD
PS : You had some good points though, like rushing to end games and stuff…
One thing to look at is release schedules. You talk about end game and stuff but compare what is released in wow vs ff14. FF14 consistantly released new dungeons and raids on a fairly regular basis. Wow generally does not release new dungeons almost ever. That new mega dungon is about the size and length of a normal ff14 dungeon. And thats all dungeon players are going to get for the entire expansion wow will not release a new dungeon until the next expansion. There seems to be some myth that wow's endgame is better or bigger than ff14 but when you look at the actual releases and content ff14 often beats wow in terms of end game content.
Your views of endgame really resonate with me. As I am an older gamer, late forties, I became perplexed when people essentially stopped playing the actual game, coining it a tutorial, and rushed headlong into the endgame; which in most cases exemplifies the least game like aspects with a heavy focus on mindless repetition, farming and grinding. I refuse to adapt to this mindset and will continue to focus on and play the game before endgame but I am worried this trend will get so popular that games will just stop providing players with meaningful and rich storylines.
Just like you said, only thing that actually kills wow is them shutting down the servers, so tired of this topic lol.. albeit not tired enough to not watch this video!
I disagree on the Endgame in WoW still being strong. The new temp systems and loot drops being practically non-existent has practically killed Mythic+ and Raiding for the guild of 100+ people I was in. Everyone quit because there was no reason to bother to keep going.
WoW player here, the new patch came out and I haven't reinstalled. FF is my new baby.
Well finally subbed, i am a wow player and leveled to max level a toon in ffxiv but i didn't enjoy any of it its not for me at all. But i do like your content, and there are many truths in what you say and an interesting take on things.
I think ffxiv and wow can co exisit because they attract different types of players.
But ffxiv needs to beware, its is now like wow was in wrath 12m player everything on the up. 5 years from now ffxiv could be were wow is now, money money money with the corporate running the show. Its a warning of the future and unless it reads it and opposes greed then it could make the same mistakes.
Fans will say yoshi P is not like that and its all ok, well that could change overnight if the corporate whished it.
The real wow killer will be the company itself.
If the ROI falls below what the company deems is the minimum, it will be cut loose.
Spouse worked for a fortune 10 company that would completely abandon a market if they weren't making at least $100 million.
They'd wait for a smaller company to rise from the ashes, hit the metrics they wanted, then buy back in.
Activision will do the same.
The only way wow to kill it self is their monotize. Defiance just killed it self
Gota say man normally i really like your incites on stuff, but in this one you seem very convinced that Wow is too big to fail and there will always be wow players.
But there are tons of content creators for Wow, specifically Classic and BC classic, who are reporting that the game is so dead theres almost no way to get Ques for things. The nostalgic feelings you mention are absoutely Valid, but i think most of that was spent on Classic wow, people are not so blinded by it anymore. People are sick of re-living the experience, when the company who owns and runs it is handling it the way they are. "Classic" is not the same as Vanilla for either orginal wow or TBC
The arguments about WoW lasting long yet, is assuming the decline started NOW, but in reality it probably started many years ago.
Also, do you really think that current blizz wouldn't shut the servers down as soon as the game don't have enough people to be very profitable?